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Post by Pavan on Dec 2, 2022 14:06:46 GMT
I guess these are coming out now! Where are you getting these?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2022 14:33:03 GMT
Tyler's Ballot!
1. Lost in Translation (2003 United States, Sofia Coppola) 2. Au revoir les enfants (1987 France, Louis Malle) 3. Barry Lyndon (1975 United Kingdom, Stanley Kubrick) 4. The Piano (1993 New Zealand, Jane Campion) 5. Picnic at Hanging Rock (1975 Australia, Peter Weir) 6. Senso (1954 Italy, Luchino Visconti) 7. Cries & Whispers (1972 Sweden, Ingmar Bergman) 8. The Story of Adele H. (1975 France, François Truffaut) 9. Raise the Red Lantern (1991 China, Zhang Yimou) 10. Tess (1979 France, Roman Polanski)
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Post by Pittsnogle_Goggins on Dec 2, 2022 15:14:15 GMT
We really need a dislike button here. with you 100%. Perfect for the takes in here complaining about a list featuring 12 female-directed films out of 100 having too many female directors. I’m not complaining there are too many female directors, but if a female director ever made a movie better than Raging Bull there’d be a better case for it not being on the list.
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flasuss
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Post by flasuss on Dec 2, 2022 15:35:54 GMT
The number of voters have doubled since 2012, going from over 800 to over 1600. And while everyone has their own individual agendas to their list (i.e. people voting for Kane out of a sense of obligation or leaving it off as a statement), I highly doubt Sight & Sound itself had some kind of agenda. Jeanne Dielman is the most acclaimed woman-directed film and if critics wanted to ensure some female representation in their list, it makes sense as the prime candidate. Add those to the people who do genuinely adore the film, rediscovered or elevated it following Akerman's passing, and the inclusion of significantly more diverse voting body and it makes sense to me. The assumption is not based on Jeanne Dielman and its ranking though - it's rather deeper - that obvious "problematic" males - Allen, Cassavetes, Peckinpah (no Wild Bunch? Bah!), Polanski - are all missing from the top 100.......and that many works about "problematic" males like Raging Bull are too - that dropped 47 places (or more) off the list - Portrait of a Lady on Fire - is not only "above" Raging Bull but 60 places above Parasite - from the same year........... It's not so hard to tilt the poll anyway - in fact it's rather easy - not that it is particularly nefarious - it's a bunch of people emailing each other - and forming tribes - its fine - I can assure us all there'll be tilting at NY & LA Film Critics - but instead of yelling and shouting in some room - it's emails and editing and whittling down.......and people really (way too much) liking Portrait of a Lady on Fire AND Citizen Kane - not so much "rigging" the poll but shaping it with an agenda....that's how it goes Also - a lot of this looks like MY MAR lists - where I don't vote for a movie because I assume you all are and to advocate for a smaller fave - and that ends up missing - because others assumed the same thing............ I am quite sure (some) people are (slightly) embarrassed by their own lists from Sight & Sound and felt like Lawrence of Arabia for example was "guaranteed" a spot......but it wasn't...... It's a mix of things - agenda, passion for the films, age, sex, race, filmmakers perceived importance / status, socio-political cultural trends - but saying there was no agenda at all seems ......unlikely ..........to me anyway...... Lawrence of Arabia is a movie about a "white savior" too...
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Post by Tommen_Saperstein on Dec 2, 2022 16:52:44 GMT
Lawrence of Arabia isn't a white savior narrative at all. He's a sadomasochistic narcissist with a god complex in search of identity and purpose that he never finds, and then he goes home to England to die in a stupid motorcycle accident. If anything the film is a deconstruction of the white savior narrative and that's among the reasons why it's so great.
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Post by pacinoyes on Dec 2, 2022 17:03:46 GMT
Now let's calm down people ........we can all disagree on this list .........but let's remember the amazing consistency of Mr. Denzel Washington - who has never had a single film - ever, anywhere - on any serious film list critical or popular (see below) .... * 0 movies in the top 100 Sight and Sound (this year, ever, on any S&S list) - 0 movies in the IMDB top 250 (ever), 0 movies in the Letterboxd Top 250 (ever), 0 in the Critics TSPDT 1000 iirc (that's 1000!), 0 in the AFI Top 100, 0 in Rotten Tomatoes Top 100..... * That's a huge rise for Mulholland Drive btw in @ #8 - with this and Meshes of the Afternoon @ 16 - that's quite a 1-2 placement of (awesome) weirdness * Good to see Ozu holding his ground - you would have thought since this maybe skewed younger this would get knocked downMy gf brought up a great point about Ozu (which I'm stealing, we're a team - um) and the Director's List - not only did he hold his own in the Main List but 4th on The Director's List too and utterly surrounded by flashier directors / films........his film is exactly the kind that should have dipped - theoretically - on BOTH lists - and it says a lot when people attack the list for being all the things his film isn't ........there's a lot to bash on this list but Tokyo Story's enduring greatness is a testament to movies not only being "great" but also being "wise" and almost impervious to ever being "outdated"......it's easy to take that for granted ......
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2022 17:16:28 GMT
Are you guys surprised that, with the obvious effort to include female directors, Lost in Translation didn't place?
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Post by ibbi on Dec 2, 2022 17:31:25 GMT
Are you guys surprised that, with the obvious effort to include female directors, Lost in Translation didn't place? Not with this crowd. Saying your favourite film directed by a woman is Lost in Translation is like saying your favourite basketball player is Lebron James.
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avnermoriarti
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Post by avnermoriarti on Dec 2, 2022 17:34:35 GMT
Are you guys surprised that, with the obvious effort to include female directors, Lost in Translation didn't place? Not really, plenty of voters are already posting their ballots and it doesn't fit the cumulative narrative of the past decade.
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Post by mikediastavrone96 on Dec 2, 2022 17:52:12 GMT
Are you guys surprised that, with the obvious effort to include female directors, Lost in Translation didn't place? I'd imagine the kind of critics making a conscious effort to include female directors would also care about other demographics (racial, cultural, etc.) and have some concerns about Lost in Translation's othering of Japanese people.
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Post by ibbi on Dec 2, 2022 18:52:03 GMT
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Post by Mattsby on Dec 2, 2022 20:06:31 GMT
Michael Mann ` Top 10 Apocalypse Now Battleship Potemkin Biutiful Dr. Strangelove Citizen Kane The Passion of Joan of Arc (Dreyer) Raging Bull Out of the Past Pale Flower (Shinoda) Confessions (Nakashima) His 2012 list had Wild Bunch, My Darling Clementine, Avatar instead of those (better) last three.
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Javi
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Post by Javi on Dec 2, 2022 20:11:27 GMT
Dunno, a critics top 100 w/o Luis Buñuel is like a literature top 100 without Milton, Boccaccio or Swift... Where's their sense of humor? Is Godard the one enfant terrible they can come up with? Pfffft... babes in the woods.
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Post by Viced on Dec 2, 2022 20:25:43 GMT
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Post by Tommen_Saperstein on Dec 2, 2022 20:37:10 GMT
"Doesn't matter who gets the votes, it matters who counts the votes" Proceeds in the next sentence to complain about more people having a vote. How long until Schrader goes full Mamet?
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Film Socialism
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Post by Film Socialism on Dec 2, 2022 20:54:18 GMT
sight & sound will almost certainly release every single ballot within the next 3 months, putting an end to this "weighted tally" discussion hopefully. of course there's the issue of "film critics are all woke now" (it's art lol people have been throwing the generational equivalent of that accusation around since 1952) but at least that has some sort tangible aesthetic critique being made instead of just unfounded conspiracy theories
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Post by pacinoyes on Dec 2, 2022 21:21:15 GMT
Schrader's quote was very precisely written and eloquent actually:
He is saying that thing I said in an earlier post - that the Main list vs. the Director's reflects the different ways fans of the medium use the cinema nowadays. Both love the medium - both want different things from it:
One list is much more "The Art I support that makes who I am" ; the other is - "this a craft - what makes you, who you are is "something else" .........that you get somewhere else
He's just expressing his loss of "the continuum" - that's 100% valid and probably close to 100% true - it's as valid as anybody else's POV anyway ..........but as the line goes from Angels in America........the world only spins forward Paul ......
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flasuss
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Post by flasuss on Dec 2, 2022 21:33:39 GMT
Lawrence of Arabia isn't a white savior narrative at all. He's a sadomasochistic narcissist with a god complex in search of identity and purpose that he never finds, and then he goes home to England to die in a stupid motorcycle accident. If anything the film is a deconstruction of the white savior narrative and that's among the reasons why it's so great. Oh, I'm well aware of this, but the woke crowd isn't.
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Film Socialism
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Post by Film Socialism on Dec 2, 2022 21:43:34 GMT
i will bet with 2 to 1 odds your precious Lawrence of Arabia features in the top 250 somewhere. the real question is, how long will it be before david blair's Wax is in one of these...
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avnermoriarti
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Post by avnermoriarti on Dec 3, 2022 0:11:09 GMT
from the man who just won Best Director with the NYFC
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Post by sterlingarcher86 on Dec 3, 2022 0:49:33 GMT
from the man who just won Best Director with the NYFC He is a ray of sunshine who must be protected
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Post by stephen on Dec 3, 2022 0:51:35 GMT
from the man who just won Best Director with the NYFC The fact I can see influences from all of these films in RRR shows this.
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avnermoriarti
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Post by avnermoriarti on Dec 3, 2022 0:57:01 GMT
meanwhile this guy voted for himself
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Post by futuretrunks on Dec 3, 2022 5:49:25 GMT
Scorsese's list is bad. The only film belonging on a top 50 is Ugetsu. I feel like Marty's listmaking is always wonky; his top 10 of the 90s was laughable compared to Ebert's, who had the balls to put Pulp Fiction above Goodfellas. Ebert would cackle at this Dielman BS, the same way he sonned The Master.
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Post by ibbi on Dec 3, 2022 9:28:43 GMT
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