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Post by urbanpatrician on Apr 11, 2024 2:36:47 GMT
pacinoyes - This is kinda like your favorite debate Like... Pacino - The Godfather: Part 2, The Godfather, Heat, The Insider......... an...... I think I'll stop short there. Bergman - Casablanca, Notorious...... Bogart - Casablanca, The Treasure of the Sierra Madre, In a Lonely Place Williams - Meek's Cutoff Swinton - Orlando Tho, if we do performances it probably rises on average 2 more per actor listed here. I'll edit in as I think of more.
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Post by futuretrunks on Apr 11, 2024 3:18:12 GMT
This topic vexes me, because film people don't seem to understand the definition of a masterpiece. It's not "everything a great artist did". It's Anna Karenina, War and Peace, and maybe Hadji Murad (from Tolstoy), despite literally everything that author wrote was incredibly readable. This idea that a Scorsese or whoever has 5-6 masterpieces is crazy. That's a term for a movie reasonably as good as The Godfather Part II. The Palm Beach Story, which is not a top 2 Sturges film, is better than any new film I've seen in 15 years, but "masterpiece"? The Lady Eve and Sullivan's Travels have an argument, but've got to make distinctions.
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Post by urbanpatrician on Apr 11, 2024 3:35:16 GMT
This topic vexes me, because film people don't seem to understand the definition of a masterpiece. It's not "everything a great artist did". It's Anna Karenina, War and Peace, and maybe Hadji Murad (from Tolstoy), despite literally everything that author wrote was incredibly readable. This idea that a Scorsese or whoever has 5-6 masterpieces is crazy. That's a term for a movie reasonably as good as The Godfather Part II. The Palm Beach Story, which is not a top 2 Sturges film, is better than any new film I've seen in 15 years, but "masterpiece"? The Lady Eve and Sullivan's Travels have an argument, but've got to make distinctions. See.... that's the thing tho. Pacino is the ONLY actor to have 4 masterpieces. That is NOT many. Just 1 guy. That's why he was voted GOAT of this forum. As for directors.... I'll maintain Hitchcock, Bunuel, Marker, Ozu, Coppola, and Mann to have about 2, or 3. Perhaps Antonioni and Wong and the other Coppola - they're on the borderline. Once again, not that many. Well.... it seems me and you are both Preston Sturges fans...... I definitely think he's superior to Wilder. |
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Post by pacinoyes on Apr 11, 2024 7:39:20 GMT
Well it's that thing I always say "The greatest actors, are in the greatest movies, oppoite the greatest co-stars, in the most memorable scenes, often for the greatest directors"
I know you're not a big Brando fan urban but Brando's entire rep is that he is in - and plays a huge part IN - 4 of the 100 greatest American films of all time - Apocalypse Now, Streetcar, Waterfront, The Godfather......take those OUT of his career and he's still great...he's just not seen in the same way ......
Having 2 is hard......many big actors don't have 1....4 is a lot ^........"Masterpiece" is a big word.....some big time actors don't have a Classic......... much less a Masterpiece - the 2 below have a couple but Network isn't a "masterpiece" imo....it's just great ...........it's tricky......
William Holden: Sunset Blvd, Wild Bunch.......
Dunaway: Bonnie & Clyde, Chinatown.....
But they aren't GOATs
Nicholson is : Maybe 2? : Chinatown.........some would say The Shining or Cuckoos Nest
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Post by urbanpatrician on Apr 11, 2024 8:06:29 GMT
Well it's that thing I always say "The greatest actors, are in the greatest movies, oppoite the greatest co-stars, in the most memorable scenes, often for the greatest directors" I know you're not a big Brando fan urban but Brando's entire rep is that he is in - and plays a huge part IN - 4 of the 100 greatest American films of all time - Apocalypse Now, Streetcar, Waterfront, The Godfather......take those OUT of his career and he's still great...he's just not seen in the same way ...... Having 2 is hard......many big actors don't have 1....4 is a lot ^........"Masterpiece" is a big word.....some big time actors don't have a Classic......... much less a Masterpiece - the 2 below have a couple but Network isn't a "masterpiece" imo....it's just great ...........it's tricky...... William Holden: Sunset Blvd, Wild Bunch....... Dunaway: Bonnie & Clyde, Chinatown..... Ehhhhh..... not exactly accurate. I'm way more non DiCaprio. non Scar Jo. non Emma Stone. Way too many threads on them. And well..... they're all kinda just ok to me. I'm kinda non Kirk Douglas too. I feel bland good man vibes with him. Don't get why he's still relevant besides being in a Kubrick and a Wilder.....eh Spartacus and Ace in the Hole and all. He was awesome in Lust for Life tho. I'm not really non Brando. He kinda makes or breaks on Streetcar/On the Waterfront/The Godfather/Last Tango tho..... he's unique in that sense, the only goat whos career makes or breaks on 4 movies. Holden is a really good choice. The Bridge on the River Kwai too. At least a classic. Stalag 17 might be my favorite Wilder. Sabrina is a romantic comedy classic. Dude has a knack for being in classics....ya know. Yet I never felt he had the fans on IMDB that Brando, Clift, Bogart, Stewart and Olivier had - I been on that board a long time. Dunaway isn't a goat to you? |
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Post by pacinoyes on Apr 11, 2024 8:41:05 GMT
Well it's that thing I always say "The greatest actors, are in the greatest movies, oppoite the greatest co-stars, in the most memorable scenes, often for the greatest directors" I know you're not a big Brando fan urban but Brando's entire rep is that he is in - and plays a huge part IN - 4 of the 100 greatest American films of all time - Apocalypse Now, Streetcar, Waterfront, The Godfather......take those OUT of his career and he's still great...he's just not seen in the same way ...... Having 2 is hard......many big actors don't have 1....4 is a lot ^........"Masterpiece" is a big word.....some big time actors don't have a Classic......... much less a Masterpiece - the 2 below have a couple but Network isn't a "masterpiece" imo....it's just great ...........it's tricky...... William Holden: Sunset Blvd, Wild Bunch....... Dunaway: Bonnie & Clyde, Chinatown..... Dunaway isn't a goat to you? Well she's like Holden........great at times - how great is arguable - but "GOAT".......is a little too high........like I could name 20 actresses in World cinema history I'd rank higher than her no sweat.............and that's too far removed from that GOAT tag for me......... We've devalued that GOAT meaning - even though the term is a joke anyway and in good fun ........ Dunaway is historically a crucial actress though - and also much higher on a GOAT American list where she avoids people like Magnani, Ullman, Huppert etc |
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Nikan
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Post by Nikan on Apr 11, 2024 8:56:26 GMT
[70s crowd]
Pacino - 3 (TG, TG2, DDA)
DeNiro - 3 (TG2, RB, GF)
Duvall - 3 (TG, TG2, AN)
Nicholson - 1 (Ch)
Hackman - 0
Burstyn - 1 (TE)
Dunaway - 1 (Ch)
Keaton - 0
Streep - 0
J.Fonda - 0
I mean I don't throw the "M" word around that much (not a big fan of it either) but I guess it's a little weightier than a "classic"... which I prefer, and if we were counting those these numbers would be higher ofc)
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