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Post by pacinoyes on Mar 17, 2024 14:53:15 GMT
It does NOT need to be 2 nominated films........just the same YEAR * I guess the obvious answer is somethng like Star Wars not winning (or whatever big movie you like sci-fi dweebs) but I always think of Night of the Living Dead in 1968.........and Oliver! * Even people who love musicals may not care for Oliver ...............but every horror fan worships on some level Night of the Livng Dead to this day........NotLD cost like 1 /100th (?) to make, every new generation rediscovers it consistently...........it is a uniquely American movie - made by a uniquely American filmmaker - but also culturally and in its setting and cultural conflict......... * It has made it's money back infinitely times over.......................got 0 nods - Oliver got 11 and won several ..........and the lead is a black man in 1968 in NotLD ffs........who is expressly chosen to lead a group of white men because he's stronger and smarter and more capable.........like if it was made now it would check off "equity" blah blah blah * NotLD is insanely relevant even now - and Oliver (which I love personally) is more........just old fashioned quaint What are some things you would argue in this kind of way.......cinematically, culturally, socially..........
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Post by stephen on Mar 17, 2024 14:55:27 GMT
I would argue 2001: A Space Odyssey is the greater disconnect in pop culture against Oliver!, as Kubrick's film is arguably the genesis of modern sci-fi and had become his signature film.
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Post by stephen on Mar 17, 2024 14:58:17 GMT
In regards to your question, I feel like a lot of the big musical bonanzas of the 1950s (particularly Vincente Minnelli's twofer of An American in Paris and Gigi) have left very little cultural footprint, especially against the likes of A Streetcar Named Desire (a landmark stage-to-screen adaptation that ushered Brando to the limelight) and Vertigo (a reappraised Hitchcock classic that routinely tops polls of the greatest film ever made). You also have Around the World in Eighty Days being forgotten, especially as John Ford's The Searchers rose in esteem in the intervening years. And then there was DeMille's maligned The Greatest Show on Earth, which has been dwarfed in retrospect by both High Noon and Singin' in the Rain.
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Post by stabcaesar on Mar 17, 2024 14:59:42 GMT
Crash over Brokeback Mountain. No BP choice has aged as poorly as this one.
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Archie
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Post by Archie on Mar 17, 2024 15:03:03 GMT
The Dark Knight not getting nominated for BP was embarrassing. And it's something that I constantly see mentioned to discredit the event.
Nobody even talks about The Reader, Milk, and Frost/Nixon these days. Slumdog Millionaire and Benjamin Button are seen as misfires too.
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Post by JangoB on Mar 17, 2024 15:20:04 GMT
1968 is a perfect example in general - it has always seemed like the old Academy's last stand against the shifting tides of the industry (New Hollywood, counterculture). That lineup just reeks of irrelevance and opposition to newness: two stuffy musicals, two costumy play adaptations (one of them Shakespeare), Rachel Rachel... surprisingly, only Newman's movie feels a little bit closer to something of interest. Whereas the year itself is remembered for cool genre shit like 2001, Rosemary's Baby, Night of the Living Dead, Bullitt and Planet of the Apes.
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Post by mikediastavrone96 on Mar 18, 2024 0:33:58 GMT
Is it too on-the-nose to again bring up Driving Miss Daisy winning while Do the Right Thing wasn't even nominated?
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Post by pacinoyes on Mar 18, 2024 20:01:52 GMT
I'm more of a believer in that Do The Right Thing ^ assessment (even though I hate that film's ending - it will never be a 4 star film to me) than I am to select one nominee against another ........I mean by definition to me NotLD is way more distant than 2001 was (see OP)..... but havng said that there's a 70s video series on Youtube where QT talks incredibly well and sharply about the two 1970 war films Patton and M*A*S*H...and how Patton was the movie of the year for one generation and M*A*S*H was the subversive one for another......and how the movies of the 70s borrow from M*A*S*H and how Altman - to use a war analogy won the war of films......it's actually one of the best analysis pieces I've come across by a director....  |
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avnermoriarti
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Post by avnermoriarti on Mar 18, 2024 20:11:47 GMT
A Beautiful Mind over any film that year.
I'm tempted to say Green Book - we we're back in 80s for a few months - but not sure which movies I'd pick instead. Roma kind of faded, First Man never got the momentum, so maybe a superhero movie: Spidey or a Marvel movie, that was a great year for the franchise. |
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Post by urbanpatrician on Mar 18, 2024 20:35:35 GMT
Being around in '99, I'd say even in 99 Cruel Intentions and The Blair Witch Project and pretty much any teen movie (1999 was year of teen power) were more relevant than any of the nominees.
American Beauty was big to adults maybe, but to teens...we just had a vague idea that Mena Suvari was in American Pie or American Beauty but we later found out she was in both. Not that American Beauty wasnt huge, and even to some teens but its target age group is probably 3-4 years older than American Pie or The Mummy which were like 12-14 yo stuff. But it hasn't aged well, and we can argue if it's even a first degree classic anymore.
The Sixth Sense was pretty big in 99, but I dont think it's nearly the classic we thought it would be. Still a remembered movie...just not The Exorcist or The Texas Chainsaw Massacre kinda first degree classics.
The Green Mile was relevant but not to teens, and some people just see it as a poor man's Shawshank.
The Cider House Rules is irrelevant and most people just remember the Oscar ads that played on TV.
And The Insider only audiences who like critics movies and best-of-the-year lists followers and Mann guys care about.
Overall I'd say The Matrix and Fight Club are the movies that have lasted. Maybe you can argue Eyes Wide Shut because the sex and orgy and late night TV aspect of it makes it a pop culture icon but most people in 99 were mild on it. Not bad not great just ho hum was the consensus.
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Post by urbanpatrician on Mar 18, 2024 21:03:22 GMT
Also....who cares about most of the 1959 nominees?
Only Ben Hur is a classic but the Hitchcock guys have elevated North by Northwest above it. The Wilder guys with Some Like it Hot too. Similar to the Mann and Fincher guys on Se7en and Heat over Braveheart. or the Wong and Nolan camp with Memento and In the Mood for Love over Gladiator.
Anatomy of a Murder is maybe a classic but can you really say it does anything better than its predecessors? Anything about it stand out? Laura is the more stand out noir if you ask me.
Compared to The 400 Blows and Hiroshima mon amour that made France the country that critics gravitated to in '59. Japan and India and Russia were still relatively obscure to Western audiences and 44 people cared about Bergman in America in 59.
I'd say the consensus for 59 has changed. Tho I guess Hitchcock and Wilder fans have always preferred NBNW and Some Like it Hot to Room at the Top, Pillow Talk and The Nuns Story.
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Post by pacinoyes on Mar 18, 2024 21:47:48 GMT
Also....who cares about most of the 1959 nominees? Only Ben Hur is a classic but the Hitchcock guys have elevated North by Northwest above it. The Wilder guys with Some Like it Hot too. Similar to the Mann and Fincher guys on Se7en and Heat over Braveheart. or the Wong and Nolan camp with Memento and In the Mood for Love over Gladiator. Anatomy of a Murder is maybe a classic but can you really say it does anything better than its predecessors? Anything about it stand out? Laura is the more stand out noir if you ask me.
Compared to The 400 Blows and Hiroshima mon amour that made France the country that critics gravitated to in '59. Japan and India and Russia were still relatively obscure to Western audiences and 44 people cared about Bergman in America in 59. I'd say the consensus for 59 has changed. Tho I guess Hitchcock and Wilder fans have always preferred NBNW and Some Like it Hot to Room at the Top, Pillow Talk and The Nuns Story. One thing I'll say for Anatomy of a Murder is that it is one of the great pre-1970s American films for acting along with Streetcar, On the Waterfront, The Hustler and Hud (and a few others)..........Anatomy of a Murder is a fascinating mix pf acting styles: Stewart: Pre-Method, Scott - NOT a method actor and maybe the best of a guy who had his own Method actually, Gazzara - essentially a Brando wannabe and Lee Remick who is very much in that post-Geraldine Page mode of new realism (alng with Piper Laurie, Joanne Woodward, etc)It always blows my mind how well those 4 actors interact with each other - and there is no awkwardness across different styles .......but yeah the films outside of America - essentially "college culture" movies were likely more culturally impactful - and there were a lot too |
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Post by mikediastavrone96 on Mar 19, 2024 3:26:49 GMT
Print out a list of every movie from 1985 and throw a dart and you'll hit a movie that's more relevant these days than Out of Africa. Back to the Future is the obvious pop culture touchstone there.
Spielberg's back-to-back losses with Raiders of the Lost Ark and E.T. the Extra-Terrestrial went with movies that kept up some staying power but have now all but faded (Chariots of Fire, Gandhi).
Picking The King's Speech over The Social Network, Inception, or Toy Story 3 was embarrassing then and only seems more embarrassing now.
I find it interesting the times the Academy actually does pick the movie that lasts in pop culture. Titanic, The Godfather, Casablanca, The Sound of Music, Rocky (though Taxi Driver would also work for that year), The Silence of the Lambs, probably Oppenheimer right now.
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Post by urbanpatrician on Mar 19, 2024 3:50:34 GMT
BP winners from '08-'12. Who cares about any of them?
Slumdog Millionaire was good family pop culture at the time (tho not a giantly appealing movie) but it probably doesnt even have the values of High School Musical nowadays. The Dark Knight guys dont even bash it for winning...they just dont give a damn about it.
The Hurt Locker except for the Bush era guys and the people who feel strongly about the era of the Iraq War (who feel a part of the time they lived thru)....who cares about that movie when it beat out a PERENNIAL Tarantino classic and the largest grossing movie of all time which didnt even end up being his best movie.
The King's Speech and Argo are about the same movies to me and The Artist is a vague blip in my mind.
BP winners from '17-'21 too besides Parasite. Besides a godly satin skinned naked Hawkins...I remember nothing of the Shape of Water. Not sure if the Emma Stone/Lanthimos guys feel Green Book robbed their girl too. As for Nomadland and Coda...I dont know if theres a movie most people are passionate about in those years but I think those 2 will fade away fast. Parasite feels like a giant blob sandwiched in between 4 blips on a radar.
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Post by paulgallo on Mar 19, 2024 8:08:26 GMT
I don't think the Academy should feel obliged to pick the movie that is most likely to have the biggest pop-cultural foot print. In a perfect world they'd shine the light on a great film that hasn't been seen by a mass audience and help it gaining more attention. In today's post-pandemic landscape with early streaming access that effect is mostly gone but a film winning Best Picture meant a big boost at the box office for said film. Would "Parasite" have today's pop-cultural status if it had not won Best Picture? It would still be hailed among cinephiles for sure, but among general audiences probably not. I mean one of the things why it's considered relevant is exactly that it achieved the landmark of the first foreign language BP winner.
Of course the Academy gets it wrong more often than not but those cases are not the times they failed to recognize huge blockbusters. Those will be fine anyway, what would have changed for today's perception of "Star Wars" or "Raiders of the Lost Ark" if they had won the Oscar for Best Picture? For a smaller film it can make a huge difference though.
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