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Post by stephen on Nov 27, 2023 0:17:43 GMT
Still trying to gather my thoughts on this one (especially as I immediately booked it to catch the Napoleon screening right after), but in short, I had an absolute blast with this one. I can definitely see why critics have been rather divided on Emerald Fennell's sophomore (but not sophomoric, despite what its detractors might tell you) film, but honestly, I was on the film's wavelength from the start, mainly because when you cast Barry Keoghan as a sly little weirdo, you're going to get just that. This movie felt like Fennell cashing in all her Oscar goodwill chips on making a bonkers Brideshead-cum- Ripley tribute (and I mean that literally) and I am so glad she did. This movie was confident, no-holds-barred, and the craft behind it was absolutely impeccable. Linus Sandgren should be sweeping cinematography in a walk this year, and the editing was razor-sharp stuff. The cast is uniformly incredible from top to bottom (no pun intended) and while I think it's ultimately Keoghan's movie, the rest of the cast are strong enough that anyone can hold the MVP title at any time they're on screen. My only criticism is the last one-take dance sequence should've had Paul Rhys's witheringly dour Duncan standing off in one corner, forced to watch Keoghan twirl in all his nude glory.
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Post by finniussnrub on Nov 27, 2023 0:49:57 GMT
Not a bit of wit, or insight into its theme. Repetitive scenes of "you don't belong here" and then Keoghan looking longingly creepy at someone or something. Cast for the most part do what they can, but even felt most were cut short from doing something truly engaging by the script. Including Keoghan, because Fennell makes the mistake of acting like the obvious twist won't be obvious, therefore leaving his performance a bit vague for most of the film rather than getting to own it the whole time.
It's pretty to look at though, though some scenes were a bit under lit, like the tutoring scene.
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Post by mikediastavrone96 on Nov 27, 2023 1:17:55 GMT
A movie that boldly asks, "what if The Talented Mr. Ripley was dumb?"
It probably shouldn't be that much of a surprise given her upbringing that Emerald Fennell (daughter to "the King of Bling") is not the most class-conscious person around, but this movie demonstrates her thoughts don't seem at all to go beyond "rich people are a bit callous and poor people wish they were rich." Not only do poor people wish they were rich, but they will go to sociopathic lengths for it. I can't imagine what she thought when she saw Parasite. There's something interesting to the idea the film works better being about parasocial relationships that Fennell has suggested in some interviews, but the setup of the text does not support the comparison there nearly as strongly as the more obvious class allegory (honestly the other Elordi film out right now fits better as a film about parasocial bonds).
I'd be willing to let the movie pass as exploitation were it not for how ponderous it felt during many of its bigger scenes, with an overbearing score to try to provide gothic overtones. Any attempt at provocation is done so slowly and with little development that it just feels entirely empty. I suppose Fennell thinks bodily fluids in a movie makes it edgier, and therefore cooler. Maybe it plays edgier since we're in the most sexless period of cinema, but here it just feels like a middle school teacher who slips the word "damn" every once in a while so you know they're with it. You can't fumble your class commentary and not even back it up with some proper freaky fun.
The cinematography looks very nice, but again in an entirely superficial One Perfect Shot kind of way. Is she saying anything through the shot selection? Not entirely, the aesthetic of much of the film is the same as nostalgic Tumblr posts. There is a motif with mirrors going on that is pretty on-the-nose and becomes less frequent as the film grows more and more transparent with its lead character (Fennell sure does love endings that are almost entirely expository). I will give credit to the choice in aspect ratio, which does proper justice to the multiple instances where the audience is acting as voyeurs to the characters, a really good choice.
All the acting was terrific, though. Keoghan as a lead gets plenty to do and is game for everything, Elordi imbues proper movie star charisma without which the whole premise of this movie would fall apart, Pike has been the queen of black comedy since Gone Girl now and never fails, the whole cast from top to bottom is uniformly excellent. I wish it were in service of better material.
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Post by Viced on Nov 29, 2023 5:54:54 GMT
If you give it more than a modicum of critical thought, it crumbles pretty quickly... but somehow... I enjoyed the hell out of it. I was thoroughly entertained from start to finish (outside of two moments where I was the 'Homer retreating back into the hedge' gif) and that's a rare feat these days. Though I am still really confused by Oliver as a character tbh. What is the point of him coming from a totally normal family/reasonably large house? Just to make him seem more nuts?! (while obviously serving as the catalyst to ruin his relationship with Felix) But even moreso, I'm still trying to figure out his overall intentions. Of course The Talented Mr. Ripley crossed my mind like it did everyone else's, but in Highsmith's novel it's pretty clearly like 90% Tom wants Dickie's life and 10% he wants Dickie (it's closer to 50/50 in the Minghella film). But in Saltburn, it seemed to be leaning waaaaay in favor of Oliver wanting just Felix over anything else... until it's suddenly the opposite. Did Oliver really relish in living at Saltburn enough for all that scheming in the end to make any sense? but I won't talk myself out of liking this batshit silly ass movie anymore... I will just enjoy the memories.
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Post by Pittsnogle_Goggins on Nov 29, 2023 13:59:37 GMT
If you give it more than a modicum of critical thought, it crumbles pretty quickly... but somehow... I enjoyed the hell out of it. I was thoroughly entertained from start to finish (outside of two moments where I was the 'Homer retreating back into the hedge' gif) and that's a rare feat these days. Though I am still really confused by Oliver as a character tbh. What is the point of him coming from a totally normal family/reasonably large house? Just to make him seem more nuts?! (while obviously serving as the catalyst to ruin his relationship with Felix) But even moreso, I'm still trying to figure out his overall intentions. Of course The Talented Mr. Ripley crossed my mind like it did everyone else's, but in Highsmith's novel it's pretty clearly like 90% Tom wants Dickie's life and 10% he wants Dickie (it's closer to 50/50 in the Minghella film). But in Saltburn, it seemed to be leaning waaaaay in favor of Oliver wanting just Felix over anything else... until it's suddenly the opposite. Did Oliver really relish in living at Saltburn enough for all that scheming in the end to make any sense? but I won't talk myself out of liking this batshit silly ass movie anymore... I will just enjoy the memories. His intentions and motivations were my biggest issue too. How much was him calculating his way to take over the house vs his obsessions with Felix (which is quite evident by the bathtub scene)? Seems the interests were either in conflict or it was much more about Felix until after the big pivot between them. Either way, I’m kinda in the similar boat of just try not to think about it too much and just enjoy the ride.
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Post by The_Cake_of_Roth on Dec 4, 2023 21:44:01 GMT
Pretty shallow stuff that thinks it’s doing something more substantial… which I might have forgiven if the movie were more committed to the over-the-top dark comedy. Triangle of Sadness wasn’t especially deep either, but at least it was funnier and more entertaining. Here, you’re just left with shock tactics that feel too try-hard, pointless, and lame.
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Post by futuretrunks on Dec 7, 2023 1:02:28 GMT
The film fell off a cliff once it hit Oliver's birthday party.
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forksforest
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Post by forksforest on Dec 8, 2023 4:21:51 GMT
I echo a lot of other thoughts on here - while it was thoroughly fun to watch, lead performances were great (Elordi surprisingly so), I don’t think it made much sense … if there even was deeper point to it. Disappointed because I loved PYM, which I’ll chalk up to being a fluke because while that was tackling important themes with a light humor that still delivered the point, this one treated “class” as a theme so arbitrarily, I don’t get what it was driving at (and feel that Fennell probably has a very shallow commentary on this issue anyways)
altogether not sure I get what drove Barry’s character - his ultimate motivation/rationale, and had they stuck to a clear motive (obsession/love, power hungry, upward social mobility?), it might have ended on a better note imo.
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forksforest
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Post by forksforest on Dec 8, 2023 4:23:32 GMT
I echo a lot of other thoughts on here - while it was thoroughly fun to watch, lead performances were great (Elordi surprisingly so), I don’t think it made much sense … if there even was deeper point to it. Disappointed because I loved PYM, which I’ll chalk up to being a fluke because while that was tackling important themes with a light humor that still delivered the point, this one treated “class” as a theme so arbitrarily, I don’t get what it was driving at (and feel that Fennell probably has a very shallow commentary on this issue anyways) altogether not sure I get what drove Barry’s character - his ultimate motivation/rationale, and had they stuck to a clear motive (obsession/love, power hungry, upward social mobility?), it might have ended on a better note imo. ETA: the more I think about it, I feel like post-Parasite, Hollywood has really had a lot of misfires when it comes to class commentary. Triangle of Sadness was a riot, but wasn’t adding anything new to these themes. The Menu, likewise. Now we have whatever tf this was
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Post by mikediastavrone96 on Dec 8, 2023 6:11:26 GMT
I echo a lot of other thoughts on here - while it was thoroughly fun to watch, lead performances were great (Elordi surprisingly so), I don’t think it made much sense … if there even was deeper point to it. Disappointed because I loved PYM, which I’ll chalk up to being a fluke because while that was tackling important themes with a light humor that still delivered the point, this one treated “class” as a theme so arbitrarily, I don’t get what it was driving at (and feel that Fennell probably has a very shallow commentary on this issue anyways) altogether not sure I get what drove Barry’s character - his ultimate motivation/rationale, and had they stuck to a clear motive (obsession/love, power hungry, upward social mobility?), it might have ended on a better note imo. ETA: the more I think about it, I feel like post-Parasite, Hollywood has really had a lot of misfires when it comes to class commentary. Triangle of Sadness was a riot, but wasn’t adding anything new to these themes. The Menu, likewise. Now we have whatever tf this was There is an appetite for class-conscious movies, but they're being made by artists that are general very well-off (and have been for some time) in studio systems that won't greenlight a movie that challenges the economic framework they operate in. It costs too much money for a studio to put out anti-capitalist (or even just critical of capitalism) movies. I imagine there's gotta be some interesting underground films that speak to this appetite, but it would take grassroots promotion as I doubt any publication charging ad space would talk about it.
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Post by stabcaesar on Dec 8, 2023 6:24:50 GMT
ETA: the more I think about it, I feel like post-Parasite, Hollywood has really had a lot of misfires when it comes to class commentary. Triangle of Sadness was a riot, but wasn’t adding anything new to these themes. The Menu, likewise. Now we have whatever tf this was There is an appetite for class-conscious movies, but they're being made by artists that are general very well-off (and have been for some time) in studio systems that won't greenlight a movie that challenges the economic framework they operate in. It costs too much money for a studio to put out anti-capitalist (or even just critical of capitalism) movies. I imagine there's gotta be some interesting underground films that speak to this appetite, but it would take grassroots promotion as I doubt any publication charging ad space would talk about it. I say just leave the class-conscious movies to European filmmakers like Ken Loach or Dardenne brothers. There's nothing more hypocritical and embarrassing than the most privileged and overpaid people on the planet lecturing the audience about wealth distribution.
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forksforest
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Saltburn.
Dec 8, 2023 15:55:44 GMT
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Post by forksforest on Dec 8, 2023 15:55:44 GMT
There is an appetite for class-conscious movies, but they're being made by artists that are general very well-off (and have been for some time) in studio systems that won't greenlight a movie that challenges the economic framework they operate in. It costs too much money for a studio to put out anti-capitalist (or even just critical of capitalism) movies. I imagine there's gotta be some interesting underground films that speak to this appetite, but it would take grassroots promotion as I doubt any publication charging ad space would talk about it. I say just leave the class-conscious movies to European filmmakers like Ken Loach or Dardenne brothers. There's nothing more hypocritical and embarrassing than the most privileged and overpaid people on the planet lecturing the audience about wealth distribution. Agreed. Lol and this was a very pointed example of an out of touch attempt
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Post by JangoB on Dec 24, 2023 12:32:06 GMT
I found it entertaining and very nicely made but it's not been a day since I watched it and I'm already feeling that it's one of those movies that don't linger in the mind for too long. And I'm surprised that there's so much discussion regarding the way the film deals with class because it eventually reveals itself as not being about that at all. You may start off thinking it's another "eat the rich" - or "eat the rich's ass" in this case - but then it's made clear that it's just a black comedy about a fucking lunatic (poor Barry being typecast). And I rather enjoyed it as such with all its silliness and thought it was a step up for Fennell after PYW. My biggest issue with the movie is the final reveal montage... I just don't understand why it was needed at all when everything was already perfectly clear. Simply cutting from Keoghan finishing his speech to Pike lying sick in the bed would've worked much better as a definite confirmation of everything we've already suspected about his character.
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Post by stabcaesar on Dec 26, 2023 10:27:12 GMT
Just finished it. The narrative is just too unbelievable, but I gotta say that Keoghan really sells it. Matt Damon's Ripley could never.
The cinematography and the production design also are unparalleled. Sandgren in particular should be cleaning up all the cinematography awards.
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Post by MsMovieStar on Dec 26, 2023 14:48:09 GMT
Oh honeys, saw shades of Pasolini's Teorema (as well as The Talented Mr Ripley & The Little Stranger) in this. It didn't strike me as being all that original despite the way people are raving about it. Was the actor who played Oliver supposed to look so much older than his peers? Perhaps it would have made more sense if that had been written in as part of the deception. Agree that the cinematography was the best thing about it.
It could have been much stronger if it had been edited down to 95 - 100 Minutes. I hate these bloated, long rambling 2hr plus movies. Whatever happened to economy of style?
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Post by sterlingarcher86 on Dec 26, 2023 15:41:29 GMT
I say just leave the class-conscious movies to European filmmakers like Ken Loach or Dardenne brothers. There's nothing more hypocritical and embarrassing than the most privileged and overpaid people on the planet lecturing the audience about wealth distribution. Agreed. Lol and this was a very pointed example of an out of touch attempt Ostlund making class satires that rich festival goers adore always cracks me up.
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Post by pacinoyes on Dec 26, 2023 17:27:52 GMT
It's interesting that people even see Saltburn as about class at all - which is its surface but actually plays out as merely an exercise in increasing depravity across classes anyway tbh The more class conscious filmmakers to me - most obviously Chabrol - was on a some level very similar to an Östlund himself - making movies for the class he loathed - Chabrol of course literally advocated for the murder of the rich and ostensibly that included - himself and Truffaut - both the most interesting contrarians themselves rather than say the more seemingly radical but simpler ones (Loach, Sayles) .....if you ever try to "spot" the Chabrol character in a Chabrol film - it's often the most vile, repulsive one
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Post by stabcaesar on Dec 26, 2023 17:31:54 GMT
It's interesting that people even see Saltburn as about class at all - which is its surface but actually plays out as merely an exercise in increasing depravity across classes anyway tbh The more class conscious filmmakers to me - most obviously Chabrol - was on a some level very similar to an Östlund himself - making movies for the class he loathed - Chabrol of course literally advocated for the murder of the rich and ostensibly that included - himself and Truffaut - both the most interesting contrarians themselves rather than say the more seemingly radical but simpler ones (Loach, Sayles) .....if you ever try to "spot" the Chabrol character in a Chabrol film - it's often the most vile, repulsive one I don't see any class commentary in this film either. Oliver is just a psychopath.
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Post by Tommen_Saperstein on Dec 27, 2023 5:06:46 GMT
absolutely ridiculous movie how is Barry never suspected for anything?? he's the last known person to see Felix and Elspeth and the police autopsy surely would've discovered poison in Felix's system... these are 80s pulp thriller rules in a 2023 movie but it's my Babylon. Deliriously entertaining, and Barry Keoghan dancing naked through a mansion is high art and will someday be exhibited in a museum.
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Post by stabcaesar on Dec 27, 2023 5:33:03 GMT
how is Barry never suspected for anything?? he's the last known person to see Felix and Elspeth and the police autopsy surely would've discovered poison in Felix's system... these are 80s pulp thriller rules in a 2023 movie Re: Felix's death, he could have stolen Farleigh's drugs and put it in Felix's bottle so it lookd like Felix died of overdose, which is the story Oliver fed to everyone. But overall I agree, the unbelievability is the major weakness of the film imo.
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LaraQ
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English Rose
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Post by LaraQ on Dec 28, 2023 13:27:59 GMT
Absolutely loved this.Might be my favourite movie of the year.Pike was MVP for me,every single line of hers was gold,but I was really impressed with Elordi too.He totally nailed his English accent.
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Post by sophiefox on Dec 30, 2023 18:44:26 GMT
i'm still processing but lmfaooo this is so coked up and unhinged and horny, like wtf 🥵🥵🥵 😂 you never know what's about to happen. bisexual king Jacob Elordi who wants to eat the rich in both ways is so fucking hot, seriously and Barry Keoghan is such a nasty little whore goddamnit 😂 - what a powerful deranged duo
bathtubs scare me now tho and it goes to show once again that mentally ill men would rather fuck psychosexual dirt than go to therapy smh
anyways, i can see why this is def not for everyone, but i loved that fucking weirdo headtrip of a movie. sue me!
EDIT to add: gotta give a shout-out to Archie Madekwe who played Farleigh. he is a riot and lit up the sceen every second of his screentime but seems to get overlooked bc everyone focuses on the leads. more!!!!
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Post by sophiefox on Dec 30, 2023 19:20:50 GMT
also, this banger
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Barbie
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Saltburn.
Mar 15, 2024 6:14:16 GMT
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Post by Barbie on Mar 15, 2024 6:14:16 GMT
I found it entertaining and very nicely made but it's not been a day since I watched it and I'm already feeling that it's one of those movies that don't linger in the mind for too long. And I'm surprised that there's so much discussion regarding the way the film deals with class because it eventually reveals itself as not being about that at all. You may start off thinking it's another "eat the rich" - or "eat the rich's ass" in this case - but then it's made clear that it's just a black comedy about a fucking lunatic (poor Barry being typecast). And I rather enjoyed it as such with all its silliness and thought it was a step up for Fennell after PYW. My biggest issue with the movie is the final reveal montage... I just don't understand why it was needed at all when everything was already perfectly clear. Simply cutting from Keoghan finishing his speech to Pike lying sick in the bed would've worked much better as a definite confirmation of everything we've already suspected about his character. Agreed. I didn’t really see it as some grand commentary on class, and I don’t think someone like Emerald Fennell is capable of it. And that’s ok. I’m tired of these post-Parasite movies wanting to be like Parasite so bad. They all have shallow analysis anyway. I’d rather have well made capitalist propaganda than whatever we’ve seen post-Parasite I liked it better than PYM as well. I found PYM annoyingly preachy so I was ready to hate watch this but I was entertained
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Barbie
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Saltburn.
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Post by Barbie on Mar 15, 2024 6:24:58 GMT
This was a fun watch for me, and I don’t think it would’ve worked as well were it not for the really good ensemble acting* led by the super talented Barry Keoghan. I thought his performance was one of the best of 2023, and if he got a Oscar nom for it, it would’ve been deserved. This movie officially made me a fan
I think people are being too harsh on this, and they’re projecting onto the movie. Can’t some things just be fun? Not everything has to be deep or is deep. I didn’t see this movie as a broad class commentary on rich and poor. I just saw it as yet another story where the characters just happened to have such wealth disparity but ultimately it was about an insecure sociopathic con artist
* Carey Mulligan was boring in her role sorry. And Archie Madekwe was the only bad actor in this ensemble. I was surprised by how amateur he is
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