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Post by jimmalone on Aug 28, 2018 8:40:15 GMT
This is really a fascinating story and it fulfilled most, but maybe not all, of my expectations. Mostly due to the direction. I think with another director at helm this could have become a superb thriller, so it was still a very good one, but Spike Lee's tone lead to some simply hilarious moments, which were great scenes in itself, but were a bit over the top sometimes and made the film more a comedy than a thriller - though from what I've heard and read about KKK members this was quite a realistic portrait of some of them and I enjoyed it in it's own way. In it's comical way it made organisations like this look more harmless than they are though and a more serious and threatening approach would have probably been more fitting and valuable to the film. You still could have had some funny moments anyway.
Subtlety was never one of Lee's strengths though and this showed also, when he made the connections to the political climate of today in general and to the Trump policy in particular. However I think for most people it may not be that obvious so it surely strengthens his message and it certainly will in the long way, when somebody, who is too young to follow politics today and will watch this film in 10 or 15 years and look back on the incidents of the Trump presidency in context with David Duke and the KKK. But this are some minor issues. Of course it's a very very important message and nowadays not less than it would have been in the 70s.
I liked the editing and the cinematography, which did it's best to give the movie a bit of a darker tone, while Adam Driver, who continues to be hit or miss for me, was the positive stand-out of the acting ensemble for me.All in all I guess this is one of Spike Lee's two best films, though I can't say yet if I prefer this one or 25th Hour.
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Post by Viced on Aug 28, 2018 20:46:32 GMT
I thought it was great and certainly top tier Spike (along with Do the Right Thing, Malcolm X, Crooklyn, He Got Game, and 25th Hour). I agree with Stephen that it's probably Spike's most unobtrusive work ever... I kept thinking to myself "when the f is there gonna be a cool dolly shot" and then was knocked out with the one he saved for the end. I liked some of the weird editing that AKenjiB mentioned too -- the double take phone hang ups and hugs... but his more restrained approach overall definitely worked.
The whole cast is great... Washington is perfect in the lead and Driver has some big moments that he nails. Plenty of great scenes... both comedic and thrilling. The lie detector/rock through the window maybe being my favorite.
The coda... I understand the complaints but it worked for me. Maybe it could've been pushed into the credits but at the same time that probably would have taken away some of the impact... I also thought it was a perfect bookend to the more comedic opening.
8.5/10 and my new #1 of the year...
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Post by mrimpossible on Aug 28, 2018 20:56:10 GMT
I liked the film until the last 30 minutes. The ending felt rushed to hell, I was so confused and then we get the jarring final scene that doesn't quite fit into the movie. Also we don't get to know Ron and Flip at all. Like who the fck is Adam Driver and John David Washington characters?
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Post by stephen on Aug 28, 2018 20:58:24 GMT
I thought it was great and certainly top tier Spike (along with Do the Right Thing, Malcolm X, Crooklyn, He Got Game, and 25th Hour). I agree with Stephen that it's probably Spike's most unobtrusive work ever... I kept thinking to myself "when the f is there gonna be a cool dolly shot" and then was knocked out with the one he saved for the end. I liked some of the weird editing that AKenjiB mentioned too -- the double take phone hang ups and hugs... but his more restrained approach overall definitely worked. The whole cast is great... Washington is perfect in the lead and Driver has some big moments that he nails. Plenty of great scenes... both comedic and thrilling. The lie detector/rock through the window maybe being my favorite. The coda... I understand the complaints but it worked for me. Maybe it could've been pushed into the credits but at the same time that probably would have taken away some of the impact... I also thought it was a perfect bookend to the more comedic opening. 8.5/10 and my new #1 of the year... No love for Inside Man? That, to me, was prime Spike before BlacKkKlansman. The more that I think on it, the more I'm glad that Lee put that coda in. The final shot of the klansman's eye with the burning cross reflected in it is a fantastic image, sure, but I think having the audience leave the theater on that image has an almost distancing effect. We don't see the man's face (I heard people wondering if it was Adam Driver's character afterward, like he'd gone back undercover despite that not being an option), and so it's easy to just dismiss it as a faceless evil. But then he hits us with the imagery of Charlottesville, and it's a poleaxing effect, knocking us to the ground like a steer in a slaughtering-pen. Some might call it a cheap trick, but all's fair in cinema, and it forces the audience to confront the harrowing reality of today's culture rather than shrugging it off as a simple period piece.
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Post by Viced on Aug 28, 2018 21:19:05 GMT
I thought it was great and certainly top tier Spike (along with Do the Right Thing, Malcolm X, Crooklyn, He Got Game, and 25th Hour). I agree with Stephen that it's probably Spike's most unobtrusive work ever... I kept thinking to myself "when the f is there gonna be a cool dolly shot" and then was knocked out with the one he saved for the end. I liked some of the weird editing that AKenjiB mentioned too -- the double take phone hang ups and hugs... but his more restrained approach overall definitely worked. The whole cast is great... Washington is perfect in the lead and Driver has some big moments that he nails. Plenty of great scenes... both comedic and thrilling. The lie detector/rock through the window maybe being my favorite. The coda... I understand the complaints but it worked for me. Maybe it could've been pushed into the credits but at the same time that probably would have taken away some of the impact... I also thought it was a perfect bookend to the more comedic opening. 8.5/10 and my new #1 of the year... No love for Inside Man? That, to me, was prime Spike before BlacKkKlansman. The more that I think on it, the more I'm glad that Lee put that coda in. The final shot of the klansman's eye with the burning cross reflected in it is a fantastic image, sure, but I think having the audience leave the theater on that image has an almost distancing effect. We don't see the man's face (I heard people wondering if it was Adam Driver's character afterward, like he'd gone back undercover despite that not being an option), and so it's easy to just dismiss it as a faceless evil. But then he hits us with the imagery of Charlottesville, and it's a poleaxing effect, knocking us to the ground like a steer in a slaughtering-pen. Some might call it a cheap trick, but all's fair in cinema, and it forces the audience to confront the harrowing reality of today's culture rather than shrugging it off as a simple period piece. Inside Man is probably next in line after those six... very good but not quite on their level. Yep... ending it with the burning cross is kind of like Ron saying "after all the shit we've been through, nothing's really changed." And then the coda doubles that down saying "after 40+ years of more shit, still nothing has really changed." The movie almost has 3 or 4 false start endings... the sting at the bar to make us feel good and then everything after that to knock us on our asses.
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Post by therealcomicman117 on Sept 5, 2018 16:12:17 GMT
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Post by wilcinema on Oct 2, 2018 10:14:56 GMT
I saw it yesterday and I loved the hell out of it. I didn't expect subtlety from Lee, and even though the film is definitely not subtle, it is still subtler than most of his work.
I only have a few issues with Driver's character. Making him Jewish, so a potential victim of the KKK, kind of felt wrong to me. It might convey the message that only if you're directly impacted by the actions of a hate group you can feel the urge to fight them. It would defeat the purpose of the movie, wouldn't it? Although I admit that I'm probably overthinking the issue.
I loved the coda. It reminds everyone that this is not a period piece, that it is a current social and political issue. Maybe all the references to Trump's speeches ("America first!") were a bit on-the-nose, but I didn't find them jarring.
About the ensemble: I actually thought that Washington was one of the weakest links. Personally I found him too goofy for the role. Driver was perfect, but my real standouts were the suspicious Klansman (Felix was his name, I think?) and his wife. Jesus, they chilled my freaking guts.
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Post by JangoB on Oct 25, 2018 14:03:29 GMT
I thought this was pretty good but imperfect and certainly not great. First off, I'm of course fine with films taking dramatic liberties with true stories if it's all done well but the amount of invention here was a little bit too much in my opinion. But still, all of that worked well for this as a piece of filmmaking so that's not a huge problem.
I just felt that the film sometimes lacked energy. I get why some people appreciate Lee's restrained direction here but I'm a huge fan of his earlier, wildly creative ways, and here the direction was just kinda...fine. But I can just imagine something like this being done by late 80s-early 90s Spike Lee and the whole thing instantly gets better. There were strong traces of that Spike in the first act though and that made me quite happy but unfortunately it all kinda went away after that.
Still, this is a damn good flick. The use of real footage in the end may seem like it's a bit too easy of a manipulative tactic, sure, but dammit it worked. Powerful stuff. And I also really appreciate that it wasn't some broad comedy that then suddenly ends with horrible real life footage - I actually didn't find much of the film funny at all and that's a hell of a compliment. Kinda like with "The Wolf of Wall Street", I wasn't laughing at the horrible people I was watching, I found it quite disturbing. So the coda felt like a totally natural progression of that unease.
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Post by JangoB on Oct 27, 2018 13:26:43 GMT
Gotta say, this one is a grower. Despite my initial reservations, I keep thinking about this movie and in hindsight I love it more. One thing I didn't mention is that awesome score by Terence Blanchard - can't get that guitar out of my head.
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Post by Viced on Oct 27, 2018 14:14:14 GMT
Gotta say, this one is a grower. Despite my initial reservations, I keep thinking about this movie and in hindsight I love it more. One thing I didn't mention is that awesome score by Terence Blanchard - can't get that guitar out of my head. "certainly not great" my ass
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Post by theycallmemrfish on Nov 8, 2018 6:08:42 GMT
Just finished it a few minutes ago, and I really liked it. Easily my favorite Lee film. Probably the only true complaint I could give is that it's 10 minutes too long. Still, it's an easy **** for me. Well made, well acted, and best of all-- gripping. Two things: 1) I've been rooting for Topher Grace for a long time (the only kid in That 70's Show who could act, and his film performances before Spider Man 3 were all quite good... especially Traffic), so I'm happy that he had a juicy role to work with... and 2) did anyone else have to pause to see if a Benjamin Button'd Michael Biehn was playing Felix? Because I literally had to.
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Post by Viced on Dec 20, 2018 23:08:53 GMT
More here, including Scorsese saying Gene Corman would have financed Mean Streets if he made the cast all black.
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Post by Martin Stett on Aug 9, 2019 1:44:07 GMT
This needed to be angrier. And more focused.
Spike Lee clearly wants to make his audiences connect this film to racism today, but his portrayal of "the Organization" as a bunch of redneck buffoons undermines the insidious casual racism that I come into contact with every day. These people are meant to be laughed at, meant to chant some shoehorned Donald Trump mantras as the movie pokes us in our ribs and says "SEE THEY'RE RACISTS AND THEY SPOUT TRUMP'S RHETORIC OHMIGAWD" without ever becoming believable faces of good honest folk that you may know personally.
The film can be funny, and it can make me go "aw shucks, racism sure is bad." It's always enjoyable enough as a movie, although certain parts of it feel undercooked (the romance angle between Ron and Patrice never goes anywhere, Flip's Jewishness never develops past "anti-semitism makes me feel bad," and there are around five different endings). Still, it's solid enough as entertainment that I can feel good about enjoying.
But there's no anger that this racism goes on today (outside of the final couple of minutes, by far the most powerful part of the movie). I can't honestly make any connection between these caricatures in the klan and in the police department and anyone I know in my life. But a connection is what Lee wants to make: he wants to grab racism by the throat and shake us until we've woken up to the damage we are doing to ourselves
I was going to post some personal anecdotes about some people I know personally, but I don't think that would be fair to them, even in an anonymous manner. I will say that I routinely encounter variations of "miscegenation will make it so hard for their children to fit in," or "it's so difficult for a white man to get a decent job anymore," or a personal favorite of mine: "White people are going to be the minority in America in thirty years, and we'll still be persecuted as the bad guys." These are all paraphrases, but they're common enough sentiments.
And the thing is, these aren't bad people saying these things. If a black person would walk up to them and strike up a conversation, they would treat them no different than anyone else. They are kind and generous and would never believe that their words, or the words of the current president of the United States, are part of a mindset of whites being better than other people. But these words have power, and they slowly creep in and take over the race discourse.
But this movie paints no responsibility on its viewer to change themselves or what's around them. It's those pesky redneck racists who give white people a bad name, they need to change.
And I find that easy target mentality to be a shame.
P.S. Ashlie Atkinson is MVP, both startlingly funny and frightening. Give this woman more major roles please!
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Post by pacinoyes on Jun 22, 2023 15:47:38 GMT
Back when Spike Lee had it he was a hit or miss guy anyway - for almost all of the mostly great (until the end) Do The Right Thing.........and the electrifying Gator sequences in the disappointing Jungle Fever his directorial style was like a machine gun - spray gunfire and see what sticks. The first 1/3 of BlacKkKlansman is his best film since like literally Do the Right Thing. Here he's kinetic, humorous in a non-heavy handed way (the "I don't like black and white movies" is quite witty in regards to The Last Picture Show), layering his points in deftly. You feel something great is coming. The middle of the film starts to slip .......lots of illogical plot developments, a gross Spike Lee special scene where the love interests discuss black exploitation films (Superfly or Shaft?), loss of tone. But still some of it sticks and hits - as when he compares the Klan codes of cover up conduct with police. But the last 1/3 of the film is a fnckin mess up until the final scene which isn't a film scene it's a real scene that you don't need to see here to have an opinion on Lee's polemic - by that point it's not a movie anymore, it is a polemic. Lee engages in several dodgy propositions in this last 3rd to try to give this story dimension and scope - touching on Birth of a Nation's place in US history for one.........it doesn't fit and Lee and his 3 other screenwriters can't make it fit - his righteous anger is replaced by an intellectual approach he can't sustain (4 screenwriters is almost never a good sign anyway)I'd say don't believe the hype...........unless you're believing it for the terrific first 1/3 .......~6.5/10 Gave this a rewatch with a friend - and I swear to God this is the most accurate review I have ever written on this site........especially that part in bold and yeah it won him an Oscar for writing (ha!) and audiences respond to it (that's nice) - but neither of those things - or Martin Scorsese's advocacy of that ending makes it work imo.........now, years later it felt exceedingly daft and outside the actual film he made
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