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Post by pupdurcs on Aug 1, 2018 12:33:58 GMT
That's quite interesting. In all these years, this is the first time I've heard you talk about Scarface with any kind of passion or as a 'great" film. I felt you always tended to be dismissive of the film itself (though appreciative of it's iconic status helping Pacino's career and longevity). Along with disregarding it as one of Pacino's top 10 performances, you used to be very 'meh' on the film itself.
Which makes sense to me, as I can't fathom thinking the film itself is great without regarding Pacino as the single most exceptional element. The two things that make this film iconic are Pacino's performance and Stone's dialogue. No one talks about Scarface for the quality of it's direction.
Anyway, it'd be a remake of a remake and neither previous version is sacrosanct. I think it's an exciting possibility that someone whom can be regarded as the greatest actor in the world is (maybe) willing to step into a role that's already been made iconic, and seeing what he can do with it. Joaquin Phoenix was being given some credit for taking on the Joker role, even though some people think Heath Ledger will forever be untouchable in the part. Certainly no one was praising Phoenix for doing a Joker film with Todd Philips.
No disrespect to Phoenix, but Washington is a bigger fish with a bigger reputation. This is a man who has just finished playing what many regard as the hardest role in American theatre and who wants to play King Lear on stage on Broadway in a few years. He doesn't exactly hide from challenges. While Washington is saying the right things and paying due respect to what Pacino did in the role, an actor like Washington lowkey loves the challenge of taking on iconic parts. That's the stage actor in him, where you want to take on great roles, even if they been performed exceptionally by other actors
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Post by pacinoyes on Aug 1, 2018 13:17:02 GMT
Well I hope no one thought I was "meh" on the film but I can see how it came across that way - I think there are films better that year and a few better performances too though again I consider them both great so sometimes you can love it and it can be great AND overrated. I mean I only rate it an 8 or so but it's great within that rating. It's an 8 that I love whereas say Raging Bull and Nashville are "better" that I sort of hate by filmmakers I love. That's a great contradiction with being a movie fan....... My real feelings on Scarface are closer to what you've heard me say in almost all of our exchanges on here : That critics, the industry, and the public are more or less fools and in the end you have to ignore them entirely - the work is the work and it stands up or it doesn't, the film doesn't change, you've changed and shouldn't hold the film accountable for that. "The masses are asses" applies to both the critical community and the public to me - and while I think its nice that the people over time made Scarface a populist classic - I never really assess the work by that. To me Scarface is a lot closer to Cruising than anything I can think of and that has none (literally, like none) of the popular elements to be received in the same way by anyone - neither critically nor by the public - yet it works in very much the same way from a directors vision - and because of that I consider that a Friedkin film in much the same way I consider Scarface a DePalma one first and foremost. Now of course its possible to respond to Scarface JUST for Pacino's work and that's fine and a lot do, I just come at it from a different angle. Like most things I guess........
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Post by TheAlwaysClassy on Aug 1, 2018 14:00:21 GMT
Denzel seems several decades too old for that role.
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Post by pacinoyes on Aug 1, 2018 14:35:20 GMT
No disrespect to Phoenix, but Washington is a bigger fish with a bigger reputation. This is a man who has just finished playing what many regard as the hardest role in American theatre and who wants to play King Lear on stage on Broadway in a few years. He doesn't exactly hide from challenges. While Washington is saying the right things and paying due respect to what Pacino did in the role, an actor like Washington lowkey loves the challenge of taking on iconic parts. That's the stage actor in him, where you want to take on great roles, even if they been performed exceptionally by other actors I'd agree with that - I totally can see Scarface appealing to the theater side of him - its a Richard III with guns (which of course Washington/Pacino played). This is the opportunity now that I think television presents to us now and is revolutionary - not for Scarface, that's obviously his if he wants it as a feature. But at 63 does it appeal to him when it starts to dawn on you, you can't play everything? I think it's really exciting that Iceman could be done right now on HBO or whatever, and done well, there's no need to lose it to the moment. We are not at that point yet but we're getting close to it - Hopkins Lear, Hopkins-McKellan's The Dresser ..............we're right on the cusp of an exciting new era for acting and projects we get to see.
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Post by fiosnasiob on Aug 1, 2018 20:20:50 GMT
I hope that Denzel is smart enough to keep not accepting doing a real remake of 1983's Scarface. I mean if they want to do a movie about a crazy Dominican drudlord, I'm all for it and it will be their most interesting project together since Training Day but they don't need to call it "a Scarface remake", they can be inspired by it, even be loosely based on it, like hundreds of movies inspired by previous classics but no need to stick the word Scarface on it. Fuqua is good at what he does but what he does isn't ambitious enough to have a world class actor like Denzel working with him so frequently. He is like the happiest man alive right now, having the guy who can magically raise the quality of his movies and brings $$$ from box office on his side (and as a friend), so he try try try (I would try hard too).
With the emergence of great black talents like Steve McQueen, Barry Jenkins or even Ryan Coogler it's sad if Denzel just keep working with Fuqua. I'm not against it, time to time but 3 of his last 5 movies are from Fuqua (haven't seen Equalizer 2 but I kinda know what I will get) and they are already talking about Equalizer 3, now Scarface remake, it's too much. And where the hell is Denzel new (oscar) project ?
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Post by pupdurcs on Aug 1, 2018 22:03:54 GMT
I hope that Denzel is smart enough to keep not accepting doing a real remake of 1983's Scarface. I mean if they want to do a movie about a crazy Dominican drudlord, I'm all for it and it will be their most interesting project together since Training Day but they don't need to call it "a Scarface remake", they can be inspired by it, even be loosely based on it, like hundreds of movies inspired by previous classics but no need to stick the word Scarface on it. Fuqua is good at what he does but what he does isn't ambitious enough to have a world class actor like Denzel working with him so frequently. He is like the happiest man alive right now, having the guy who can magically raise the quality of his movies and brings $$$ from box office on his side (and as a friend), so he try try try (I would try hard too). With the emergence of great black talents like Steve McQueen, Barry Jenkins or even Ryan Coogler it's sad if Denzel just keep working with Fuqua. I'm not against it, time to time but 3 of his last 5 movies are from Fuqua (haven't seen Equalizer 2 but I kinda know what I will get) and they are already talking about Equalizer 3, now Scarface remake, it's too much. And where the hell is Denzel new (oscar) project ? I know what you are saying, and I used to feel the same way when he kept dipping into the Tony Scott well (another train movie!?! Really ). Scott was good at what he did, but obviously used Denzel as a safety blanket as well. But I give Fuqua some credit....he's trying to put Denzel in different situations or give him something different to play. I always thought Denzel would be perfect for a western, but clearly few (white) filmmakers thought of him in that context. So you'd get everyone from Russell Crowe to Christian Bale crossing westerns off their bucket lists, while Denzel was only put in contemporary thrillers (Scott was guilty of this a bit). The Magnificent Seven remake might not be the greatest western ever made, but as a fan, I really appreciate the imagination Fuqua had to see Denzel as a cowboy and put him front and centre in a western. The Coen Brothers or whomever would call up everyone from Matt Damon to Michael Keaton to be in a western before they thought of Denzel, because they think of leads in western movies as automatically being white men. Fuqua got Denzel to cross of a bucket list genre most actors want to do. Now he wants him to try out a completely different voice for the proposed Scarface remake. Has anyone even asked Denzel to even do a non-American accent in the last 20 years? He's already giving Denzel more opportunity for variation than Scott really did (much as I love Man on Fire and Crimson Tide). The studio that owns the rights and attached Fuqua to the film are going to want it called Scarface, because of the name recognition. Fuqua cannot change that (nor could Denzel if he signs up). Yes, there will be plenty of carping from fans of the Pacino movie because it's called Scarface and they would prefer no other version exists, but that's life. They'll get over it and that movie (and the Muni/Howard Hawks one, if they even care) will still exist. Denzel is bulletproof. I can't remember the last time he took a real L. Even when he's had a rare box office flop (Roman J Israel Esq), he still gets an oscar nomination out of it. If there is one "name" actor alive who can take on the cult of the Pacino/DePalma Scarface and come out of it unscathed, it's Mr Washington. So basically, I'm not worried about any backlash (critics will probably hate it on principle, but they also hated the DePalma Scarface as well at first.LOL!). I defintely want Denzel to do some stuff with these new generation of black auteurs as well. But it doesn't sound like they've had anything on the table to suit him yet. If they are writing scripts for him (like Dan Gilroy did), then I'm sure he'd sign up. I expect it'll come at some point. Still, Denzel said recently that he's working on a new film with Robert Zemeckis, so it seems like Zemeckis will be his new Oscar friendly auteur partnership.
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Post by fiosnasiob on Aug 2, 2018 13:34:00 GMT
Yes you are right, let's give him credits for at least giving Denzel the opportunity to be the lead in a western and Denzel definitely had fun doing it. Even if at the end of the day, it doesn't crack his top 20 performances, to me at least. Now adding more complex character role to that "something different to play" for Denzel to do wonders is the way to go. Almost 10 movies since Training Day and to me, Fuqua is yet to even approach what he did in that film.
Oh I didn't knew he was working on a new film with Robert Zemeckis, I will try to read more about it. Even if Denzel has no "prime" and has been consistently brillant for more than 30 years I feel like his love and passion for the art of acting is more obvious and relevant than ever, he is maybe even at his zenith. That's why it piss me off to see no new serious project (even if we just had a back to back oscar nominations from him) when he probably has a "Last Tango" in him right now. Well Fences and Flight are 2 of the great modern film performances to me but he has one to definitely kill the game.
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Post by pupdurcs on Aug 9, 2018 15:46:35 GMT
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Post by Tommen_Saperstein on Aug 9, 2018 18:46:01 GMT
you lost me at "Antoine Fuqua"
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Post by jakesully on Aug 10, 2018 16:13:58 GMT
I'd choose Oscar Issac to be the new Scarface.
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Post by moonman157 on Aug 10, 2018 18:22:06 GMT
So many bad De Palma takes in here I don't even know what to do. Scarface is one of his weakest btw.
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Post by alexanderblanchett on Aug 11, 2018 12:56:24 GMT
That could indeed work
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Lubezki
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Post by Lubezki on May 14, 2020 18:36:16 GMT
linkMaybe this deserves it's own thread as I'm not sure if both are related so if you want Viced you can just move it.
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Post by Pavan on May 14, 2020 19:07:40 GMT
Pacino's Scarface is iconic but i'm tempted to see what Guadagnino can offer with the help of Coen bros.
At least it's not Fuqua.
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Post by pacinoyes on May 14, 2020 19:11:02 GMT
I sort of like this weird thing Guadagnino is trying of going from decade to decade and destroying a pop culture movie landmark while telling fans "It's not a remake!
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Post by TerryMontana on May 14, 2020 20:20:48 GMT
A Scarface remake... ...written by the Coens???
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wattsnew
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Post by wattsnew on May 14, 2020 21:31:07 GMT
Sounds like ham potential for someone. Jake Gyllenhaal?
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The-Havok
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Post by The-Havok on May 14, 2020 22:37:19 GMT
Hopefully they shed some light on the amazing Mexican actors who can play the shit out of this role.
FYC José María Yazpik who plays Armando Carrillo Fuentes in Narcos
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Post by mhynson27 on May 15, 2020 2:16:58 GMT
linkMaybe this deserves it's own thread as I'm not sure if both are related so if you want Viced you can just move it. “Tell Me by Your Name”
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Post by Tommen_Saperstein on May 15, 2020 2:26:45 GMT
hmm, I liked Suspiria a lot but I hope Guadagnino doesn't make a habit of remake-hopping (A Bigger Splash was a remake too wasn't it?).
Honestly I'd like nothing more from him than an original horror film.
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Post by jakesully on May 15, 2020 18:05:19 GMT
linkMaybe this deserves it's own thread as I'm not sure if both are related so if you want Viced you can just move it. “Tell Me by Your Name” Haha that's pretty good! and I still stand by my comment that Oscar Issac should be the new Scarface (since the Coens are helming the script) he was so good in Inside Llewyn Davis (but maybe he's way too old for the role I don't know ). Guadagnino is a pretty damn good director so I'll give this one a chance for sure.
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Post by pacinoyes on May 16, 2020 12:22:28 GMT
Michael B. Jordan is the rumored lead now - disregard the small-time link but you hear it more in social media chatter - not that I'm on social media but so friends tell me. This may just be an out of control rumor I dunno...... Jordan possibly engaging in many dubious things lately - that Danny Boyle movie for one.........and this possibly.......use your head Michael....... I mean it "theoretically" could work but "theoretically" we all have a shot with Ana de Armas too in the aftermath of the Affleck Catastrophe....... and at least half of this board really doesn't ammirite? www.highsnobiety.com/p/michael-b-jordan-scarface-reboot
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Post by mhynson27 on May 16, 2020 12:50:26 GMT
Michael B. Jordan is the rumored lead now - disregard the small-time link but you hear it more in social media chatter - not that I'm on social media but so friends tell me. This may just be an out of control rumor I dunno...... Jordan possibly engaging in many dubious things lately - that Danny Boyle movie for one.........and this possibly.......use your head Michael....... I mean it "theoretically" could work but "theoretically" we all have a shot with Ana de Armas too in the aftermath of the Affleck Catastrophe....... and at least half of this board really doesn't ammirite? www.highsnobiety.com/p/michael-b-jordan-scarface-rebootHow is wanting to work with Danny Boyle and Luca Guadagnino 'dubious' and constitutes not using his head? Both of those directors have almost flawless track records and it's good to see Jordan branching out and working with some top tier talent. Inherently every movie is a risk, so why not join a couple with some real fire power behind them.
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Post by pupdurcs on May 16, 2020 13:05:56 GMT
Michael B. Jordan is the rumored lead now - disregard the small-time link but you hear it more in social media chatter - not that I'm on social media but so friends tell me. This may just be an out of control rumor I dunno...... Jordan possibly engaging in many dubious things lately - that Danny Boyle movie for one.........and this possibly.......use your head Michael....... I mean it "theoretically" could work but "theoretically" we all have a shot with Ana de Armas too in the aftermath of the Affleck Catastrophe....... and at least half of this board really doesn't ammirite? www.highsnobiety.com/p/michael-b-jordan-scarface-rebootHow is wanting to work with Danny Boyle and Luca Guadagnino 'dubious' and constitutes not using his head? Both of those directors have almost flawless track records and it's good to see Jordan branching out and working with some top tier talent. Inherently every movie is a risk, so why not join a couple with some real fire power behind them. Yeah, not sure I get this hot take either. Especially for a young African-American leading man, it's rare to have the breadth of options that allow him to work with auteurs as highly regarded as Boyle and sophisticated as Guadagnino, whose work doesn't specifically tend to lean into black issues and therefore black casting (like his go-to director Ryan Coogler) is really quite a flex and power move. It starts putting him right up there with your Timothee Chalamet's or whomever in terms of young leading men that all the auteurs want to work with. People like that eventually become the next Bales, DiCaprios and Phoenixs and so forth .Working with two names like Boyle and Guadagdino is a huge positive step in the evolution of Jordan's career. It automatically makes him more attractive to other auteurs.
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Post by pacinoyes on May 16, 2020 13:09:07 GMT
Michael B. Jordan is the rumored lead now - disregard the small-time link but you hear it more in social media chatter - not that I'm on social media but so friends tell me. This may just be an out of control rumor I dunno...... Jordan possibly engaging in many dubious things lately - that Danny Boyle movie for one.........and this possibly.......use your head Michael....... I mean it "theoretically" could work but "theoretically" we all have a shot with Ana de Armas too in the aftermath of the Affleck Catastrophe....... and at least half of this board really doesn't ammirite? www.highsnobiety.com/p/michael-b-jordan-scarface-reboot How is wanting to work with Danny Boyle and Luca Guadagnino 'dubious' and constitutes not using his head? Both of those directors have almost flawless track records and it's good to see Jordan branching out and working with some top tier talent. Inherently every movie is a risk, so why not join a couple with some real fire power behind them. Well sure, everything "could" work out but I'd be intrigued as to why you think the Boyle sounds more likely to be good than bad tbh? I'm dead serious......convince me of that: movie-awards-redux.freeforums.net/thread/16363/michael-jordan-methuselah-danny-boyleGuadagnino is coming off a major box-office flop for a high profile remake a WW gross of 1/3 its budget.........(if Jordan does it).......so it could work out......but..... I think these 2 sound shaky at best............so ..........it's dubious to me at least........
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