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Post by mhynson27 on Nov 2, 2017 14:17:16 GMT
Surprised there isn't already a thread for this considering we're 6 episodes in. Everyones thoughts so far?
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Post by stephen on Nov 2, 2017 18:22:15 GMT
I think it's been a great pre-merge, and I love that the unwieldy theme has been all but abandoned. Last night's boot was a blindside to me, and even though a promising player went out, I'm really pleased with the cast we've got for the post-merge phase. Rooting for Chrissy, Ben, Lauren, Ashley and Dr. Mike the most, but really, almost all of them are likable.
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Post by cheesecake on Nov 7, 2017 15:22:04 GMT
I'm really enjoying it! I like the change ups of a three tribe swap back into three tribes. This merge is going to be so interesting. The focus on character moments, more camp life and surprising boots has also been really appreciated.
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Post by mhynson27 on Dec 21, 2017 14:55:51 GMT
Well that's just fucking bullshit.
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Post by stephen on Dec 21, 2017 17:03:02 GMT
Well that's just fucking bullshit. I agree, but not for the reasons a lot of people are saying. Here's the thing: I don't blame Ben. Production really went overboard with advantages and shit, and I don't really like this F4 twist, but it's not his fault. Also, they all deserved to lose after Ben kept finding idols (a known quantity in the game) when they were still playable. I'm seeing a lot of Ben hate, and I don't like it. I would've loved a Devon/Chrissy victory, but Ben earned his the hard way and I think he was a worthy winner. Hell, Yul's super-idol was more egregious in terms of production interference, but hardly anyone gripes about him. I actually don't hate the F4 fire-making challenge in theory. I kinda like the concept in that it removes someone driving two goats to the end. Plus Ben had no idea until right before it happened that it was in play. I just wish that it had been announced at the start of the game. That way, you have to really work hard to ensure that someone like Ben goes out early, and you have to manage your alliances/options much more readily than simple F3 deals. I don't mind game change-ups, but know what you're playing before the season starts. Twists are great for the viewer, but not the player. Devon could make a real Stacey Stillman-esque argument if he wanted, but then again, he knew about it and Ben didn't. I think that despite that F4 issue, Ben played a terrific game for someone in his position, and it was the others' faults for not keeping an eye on him. Him finding an idol the first time is forgivable. The second time, not so much. The third time was unconscionable, and they all should've just signed away the money to Ben in that moment. Ben had no real shield the entire time. He was basically Tom Westman without the challenge prowess; a target that got so big that the only way he had a shot was to take advantage of a known gameplay mechanic (idols) and his grit and determination saw him never give up. The others got way too cocky and lackadaisical. Essentially, I think that the hate is warranted, but it shouldn't be directed at Ben. It's on production for not announcing the F4 twist at the start of the game, in order to make it much more complex. I think seasons afterward will benefit from this being a known factor in the game, but it was a sloppy way to introduce it. Still, it was a badass showdown.
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Post by mhynson27 on Dec 22, 2017 0:12:43 GMT
Well that's just fucking bullshit. I agree, but not for the reasons a lot of people are saying. Here's the thing: I don't blame Ben. Production really went overboard with advantages and shit, and I don't really like this F4 twist, but it's not his fault. Also, they all deserved to lose after Ben kept finding idols (a known quantity in the game) when they were still playable. I'm seeing a lot of Ben hate, and I don't like it. I would've loved a Devon/Chrissy victory, but Ben earned his the hard way and I think he was a worthy winner. Hell, Yul's super-idol was more egregious in terms of production interference, but hardly anyone gripes about him. I actually don't hate the F4 fire-making challenge in theory. I kinda like the concept in that it removes someone driving two goats to the end. Plus Ben had no idea until right before it happened that it was in play. I just wish that it had been announced at the start of the game. That way, you have to really work hard to ensure that someone like Ben goes out early, and you have to manage your alliances/options much more readily than simple F3 deals. I don't mind game change-ups, but know what you're playing before the season starts. Twists are great for the viewer, but not the player. Devon could make a real Stacey Stillman-esque argument if he wanted, but then again, he knew about it and Ben didn't. I think that despite that F4 issue, Ben played a terrific game for someone in his position, and it was the others' faults for not keeping an eye on him. Him finding an idol the first time is forgivable. The second time, not so much. The third time was unconscionable, and they all should've just signed away the money to Ben in that moment. Ben had no real shield the entire time. He was basically Tom Westman without the challenge prowess; a target that got so big that the only way he had a shot was to take advantage of a known gameplay mechanic (idols) and his grit and determination saw him never give up. The others got way too cocky and lackadaisical. Essentially, I think that the hate is warranted, but it shouldn't be directed at Ben. It's on production for not announcing the F4 twist at the start of the game, in order to make it much more complex. I think seasons afterward will benefit from this being a known factor in the game, but it was a sloppy way to introduce it. Still, it was a badass showdown. I 100% agree that the hate Ben is getting isn't warranted and he did play a pretty good game but it honestly feels like the 'twist' was thrown in at the last minute to pretty much guarantee Ben would make it to the end. It felt like heavy production tampering and it totally fucked over Devon.
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Post by stephen on Dec 22, 2017 0:35:24 GMT
I agree, but not for the reasons a lot of people are saying. Here's the thing: I don't blame Ben. Production really went overboard with advantages and shit, and I don't really like this F4 twist, but it's not his fault. Also, they all deserved to lose after Ben kept finding idols (a known quantity in the game) when they were still playable. I'm seeing a lot of Ben hate, and I don't like it. I would've loved a Devon/Chrissy victory, but Ben earned his the hard way and I think he was a worthy winner. Hell, Yul's super-idol was more egregious in terms of production interference, but hardly anyone gripes about him. I actually don't hate the F4 fire-making challenge in theory. I kinda like the concept in that it removes someone driving two goats to the end. Plus Ben had no idea until right before it happened that it was in play. I just wish that it had been announced at the start of the game. That way, you have to really work hard to ensure that someone like Ben goes out early, and you have to manage your alliances/options much more readily than simple F3 deals. I don't mind game change-ups, but know what you're playing before the season starts. Twists are great for the viewer, but not the player. Devon could make a real Stacey Stillman-esque argument if he wanted, but then again, he knew about it and Ben didn't. I think that despite that F4 issue, Ben played a terrific game for someone in his position, and it was the others' faults for not keeping an eye on him. Him finding an idol the first time is forgivable. The second time, not so much. The third time was unconscionable, and they all should've just signed away the money to Ben in that moment. Ben had no real shield the entire time. He was basically Tom Westman without the challenge prowess; a target that got so big that the only way he had a shot was to take advantage of a known gameplay mechanic (idols) and his grit and determination saw him never give up. The others got way too cocky and lackadaisical. Essentially, I think that the hate is warranted, but it shouldn't be directed at Ben. It's on production for not announcing the F4 twist at the start of the game, in order to make it much more complex. I think seasons afterward will benefit from this being a known factor in the game, but it was a sloppy way to introduce it. Still, it was a badass showdown. I 100% agree that the hate Ben is getting isn't warranted and he did play a pretty good game but it honestly feels like the 'twist' was thrown in at the last minute to pretty much guarantee Ben would make it to the end. It felt like heavy production tampering and it totally fucked over Devon. I don't think the twist was thrown in at the last minute (at least, no more than the mutiny twist in Cook Islands; if ever there was production tampering post-Borneo, that was it), but it was poorly constructed. They should've made the castaways aware that it was happening (or, at least, tell them that there is a change happening at the F4 that would necessitate the contestants having to create back-up plans). I think Ben capitalized as well as anyone could have done with the challenge, as if Devon wins it becomes all for naught. I don't like how it was handled this season for the reasons I enumerated above, but I like the concept of a showdown at F4 to take that final spot at FTC. I definitely agree that Devon got fucked over in the grand scheme of things, although I think he should've argued his case to Chrissy about why he should stay over Ryan. He might have been able to sway Chrissy into forcing Ryan into a fire-making challenge with Ben instead by reasoning that if Ryan lost, Chrissy would have an automatic vote on the jury. Devon took his fate in his own hands and lost. But really, this season's end result needed to happen if only to reiterate a key point: never get comfortable on Survivor. There are always ways to get out of trouble, and if your target's back is against the wall and they've got nothing to lose, they will fuck your game over.
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Post by Martin Stett on Jan 8, 2022 4:43:22 GMT
I think I stopped watching this show at All-Stars, so it's been a long time. Around nine years ago, I joined an online Survivor game and it was an awesome experience (subsequent plays were not very fun, so I don't do it anymore). There was a twist the hosts implemented in that game that was AMAZING and I'm wondering if the show has ever done something like it.
The twist was called "the snitch." (The game was Alcatraz Island themed.) Before the immunity challenge, every player in the game would perform a secret challenge individually. The winner would be notified privately, and they would become "the snitch." This player could put anyone in the game into "solitary confinement" for the following immunity challenge - thus giving that tribe a one-player handicap, although one that could be overcome - and for the following tribal council. If that tribe went to TC, the imprisoned player obviously couldn't cast a vote (or get voted out). The "snitch" would vote in their stead.
This was the cause of some very interesting plays. For example, my tribe with seven players had a dividing line that was pretty much 4-3. One of us outsider three won the snitch and stuck one of the insider four in solitary... meaning that if the outsiders threw the challenge, we would have majority for this vote, and make the tribe 3-3. We did that, but even then we were not out of the woods because we had a 3-3 split, and with a snitch could easily make that 4-2 if things got hairy (our tribe was a warzone from the start, it was so much fun compared to the peaceful, chill folks on the other side). That is just one example (that ended with me serving our ringleader's head to the insiders on a platter in a desperate scramble to survive... which worked quite well in the long run, I'm proud to say).
Has the show ever given that sort of power to someone each round, and if so, what have been the effects of it? I know that playing in that game was undeniably one of the most fun experiences of my life, and that mechanic was a big part of what made it so slippery.
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Post by stephen on Jan 8, 2022 4:51:33 GMT
There's never been a twist quite like that put into the game, but there have been some twists kind of in the ballpark. There was a season called "Ghost Island" where players on a losing tribe would be banished to an island where they could gamble their vote for a shot at an advantage in the game, and the advantage could be either a timed immunity idol that was only good for X amount of rounds, or an extra vote, or a reward steal. A couple of other seasons have variants on these.
There was also a twist on this most recent season that allowed for one player to actually "turn back time." What that meant was that at the merge, there were two teams competing for immunity, with the winning team becoming entirely immune and the losing team being eligible to have one member voted out. There was an odd number of players at the merge, however, so the odd person out (who picked a different colored rock than the others) wound up being sent to Exile Island. There, this player was given the opportunity to reverse the results of the immunity challenge, which invalidated the previous challenge and gave themselves and the losing team immunity. It was a widely panned twist (as so many of the show's twists have been) because the incentive for this player to take that opportunity was an obvious one, and there was zero risk for them to do so. I personally didn't hate the twist but I do think the player should've had to sacrifice their vote for two rounds in order to guarantee that immunity.
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