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Post by stephen on Apr 26, 2018 23:10:42 GMT
I really wish that people were more keen to record plays in a more cinematic fashion for home purchase. What I wouldn't give to see Rylance's Jerusalem on a proper DVD release, rather than having seen a shitty video copy that circulated the 'net several years ago (even with that bad transfer, Rylance gave one of the best performances I have ever seen, and with his newfound film career, the fact that no one is talking about a film adaptation is ludicrous to me). I missed this part of your post before stephen, but let me tell you this about Jerusalem.......that year I thought Pacino was going to win his 3rd Tony - and it was going to be a huge deal I thought - in some ways the crowning achievement of his entire career (now I hope that's The Irishman) - an American winning his 3rd Tony for Shakespeare? That hasn't happened in Lead in a long, long time (ever maybe? - I'm serious I don't think its been done by an American)......even though I don't put much stock in the Tony Award, this seemed divine justice to me. Finally no one could argue with this I thought - this is a big deal. Rylance was going to push his production to the following season but he just barely got it in, in time - there was some controversy that the whole cast could come over or else he said he wouldn't do it. When tickets went on sale I was like "Fnck it, let's go see it - let's see what he can do - Mr. Great Actor!!!!" Well, um.......... I had seen him before, in a Tony winning role (Boeing Boeing) but was completely unprepared for this. Not only was he amazing, just physically was unbelievable - almost hard to comprehend - talk about carrying a play on your back. Like he was possessed. It's the only performance that has ever rivaled Fiennes' Hamlet for me. That year at the Tony broadcast Rylance in great spirits while walking up to the stage gave a tap/hello to Bobby Cannavale (also a nominee that year) and Pacino had to sit there and graciously applaud the guy who's his friend and whom he "never misses" on stage. I remember watching that year and thinking it's like the way resigned way Pacino's Vince Hanna says "Yeah" at the end of Heat .........Sometimes you just have to tip your hat, applaud and say to yourself, if anybody was going to beat me, I'm glad it was you, mother******.  Watching Rylance in Jerusalem, even in the quality I did, gave me the feeling I had when I saw Daniel Day-Lewis in There Will Be Blood for the first time. I recognized I was seeing not just greatness, but landmark greatness, iconic greatness -- the sort of greatness that is both singular and yet spawns legions of followers while leaving most people wondering how the fuck they came up with that to begin with. |
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Post by pupdurcs on Apr 27, 2018 0:34:53 GMT
Very positive review for the play (though he thinks others may find it divisive) and a rave for Washington from the most important theatre critic, Ben Brantley of the New York Times. Brantley suggests Washington may be in some ways the most fully realised Hickey he's seen (including Jason Robards, Lee Marvin and Kevin Spacey). www.nytimes.com/2018/04/26/theater/review-iceman-cometh-denzel-washington.htmlReview: In an Energized ‘Iceman,’ the Drinks are on Denzel THE ICEMAN COMETH NYT Critic’s Pick Broadway, Play, Drama 3 hrs. and 50 min. Closing Date: July 1, 2018 Bernard B. Jacobs Theater, 242 W. 45th St. 212-239-6200 By BEN BRANTLEYAPRIL 26, 2018 If you have a good time at a production of “The Iceman Cometh,” does that mean the show hasn’t done its job? I was beaming like a tickled 2-year-old during much of George C. Wolfe’s revival of Eugene O’Neill’s behemoth barroom tragedy, which opened on Thursday night at the Bernard B. Jacobs Theater, with Denzel Washington more than earning his salary as its commanding star. A sustained grin may not seem an apt response to a play in which desperate, drunken denial is the given existential condition, and suicide and murder are presented as perfectly reasonable life choices for anyone who sees the world clearly. Besides, to smile through nearly four hours of doomed, rotgut-soaked souls mouthing the same hopeless blather over and over again would appear to be courting lockjaw, if not temporary insanity. Surely, the more appropriate and customary behavior for an “Iceman” audience member would echo that of the play’s cynic-in-chief, a disenchanted socialist (played here with ashen anger by David Morse), who says, “I took a seat in the grandstand of philosophical detachment to fall asleep observing the cannibals do their death dance.” But who’s going to feel like nodding off, or slump into terminal angst, when Mr. Wolfe has filled the stage with such delectably seasoned hams, who lap up limelight the way their characters throw back booze? In addition to Mr. Washington and Mr. Morse, this “Iceman” boasts a fine rogue’s gallery of performers who gladden the heart whenever they show up on a New York stage, including Colm Meaney, Bill Irwin, Danny McCarthy, Tammy Blanchard, Neal Huff, Reg Rogers, Michael Potts and Frank Wood. The denizens of Harry Hope’s last-chance bar in the downtown Manhattan of 1912 (that’s the wonderful Mr. Meaney as the crankily sentimental Harry) are such a scrappy, funny, madly posturing crew that you may not even share their impatience for the Big Guy to show up. That’s Theodore Hickman, known to his pals as Hickey, who is portrayed by Mr. Washington, this production’s Oscar- and Tony-winning star, and its commercial raison d’être. Hickey, a traveling salesman and perennial life of the party, doesn’t make his entrance until nearly an hour into show. The other characters, who had so eagerly awaited his arrival, wind up hostile to and disappointed with their usually inebriated pal, who has dared to go on the wagon and be really, really serious. Rest assured that you will not feel similarly let down by Mr. Washington’s center-of-gravity performance, or at least not by the play’s conclusion. Mr. Wolfe’s energetic interpretation of this 1946 drama (which a friend of mind suggested should be retitled “The Iceman Rompeth”) is likely to be divisive. Most productions — including Robert Falls’s acclaimed, Chicago-born version starring Nathan Lane, seen at the Brooklyn Academy of Music in 2015 — tend to elicit adjectives like “searing” and “devastating” (on the positive side) and “narcotic” and “way too long” (on the negative). After all, this is a work in which life is revealed, none too subtly, to be so crushing that the only way to get through it is to live in a cloud of illusions, or pipe dreams, to use one of O’Neill’s favorite terms. The characters employed to illustrate this point — a group of outcasts and also-rans who hide their heads in whiskey bottles and carefully tended rationalizations — are, as drunks often tend to be, an unbearably garrulous lot. That means that in addition to being one of the longest of great American plays, “Iceman” is also one of the most repetitive. You pretty much get everything it has to say during the first 20 minutes or so. O’Neill wasn’t wrong, though, in the self-admiring assessment he made in a 1940 letter to the critic George Jean Nathan, to whom he had sent an early draft. “I feel there are moments in it,” he wrote, “that hit as deeply into the farce and humor and pity and ironic tragedy of life as anything in modern drama.” Watching this latest incarnation, I laughed more often than I teared up. But this “Iceman” — which has been beautifully designed by Santo Loquasto (the increasingly abstract set), Ann Roth (costumes), Jules Fisher and Peggy Eisenhauer (the wondrous, color-coded lighting) and sound (Dan Moses Schreier) — acquires its own poignant lyricism, while vividly reminding us that in life, comedy and tragedy are seldom mutually exclusive. With its heightened performances and tone-poem visuals, this production also clearly elicits the musical nature of “Iceman,” which is in some ways closer to opera or oratorio than it is to conventional drama. On the page, its words can seem as blunt and cipher-like as notes on a musical staff. It is when you hear them spoken that they spring into interconnected life. All those repeated phrases take on the haunting insistence of melodic motifs. We’re reminded that all of us, no matter how we like to think otherwise, tend to be stuck in a single song of identity, on which we render only slight variations. The cast members here capture that monotony, to which their characters cling like a security blanket. And they exaggerate it to highly entertaining effect, in their arias and overlapping duets of lamentation and accusation. In fabricating their hopeful visions of their hopeless lives, O’Neill’s barflies are always performing, for themselves as well as the others. How right it feels that each of the men who have made Harry’s dive and boardinghouse their home — first seen as in a “Last Supper”-like tableau of sleeping figures — should stir to life when a subtle spotlight picks him out. They’re each as enticingly grotesque as a caricature by Goya or Daumier, thanks in part to their distinctively disheveled coifs. (Mia M. Neal did the great and essential hair and wigs.) I don’t have space to do a full roll call, as Larry Slade (Mr. Morse) does for the benefit of the newest and youngest resident, Don Parritt (the open-faced Austin Butler, in a sensationally assured Broadway debut). But for inhabitants of a place regularly characterized as a morgue, they are an exceptionally vibrant group. They love telling their lies, and these actors (whose profession, after all, is lying) love giving flamboyant life to such falsehoods. And then good old Hickey shows up, with his toothy smile and goofy jokes. At first, he seems to fit right in, as expected. But since he is portrayed by Mr. Washington, a specialist in layers of feeling, we notice an unsettling, even menacing blankness whenever his face is in repose. You know exactly what Mr. Butler’s character means when he says of Hickey, “There’s something that isn’t human behind his damned grinning and kidding.” That’s not just because Hickey is on a mission to save his former drinking buddies from their delusions, to make them face reality, as he swears he has done. More than any Hickey I’ve seen (including Kevin Spacey and, Lee Marvin and Jason Robards), Mr. Washington makes us sense that Hickey hasn’t entirely bought his own bill of truth-peddling goods. Hickey’s long, revelatory monologue at the end of Act III — when he explains the events that turned him from carefree party boy into a cold-sober judge of others — is often delivered as a flashy nervous breakdown to the rest of the cast. In this version, Hickey moves a chair to the edge of the stage and delivers his soliloquy naturalistically, right to us. As he keeps trying — and failing — to justify himself, a chill creeps over the audience. That’s when I stopped smiling. The party is finally, truly over, and so are the lies within lies. And suddenly Mr. Wolfe and Mr. Washington have slapped us with that mother of all hangovers, which for O’Neill is life itself. |
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Post by pupdurcs on Apr 27, 2018 0:52:39 GMT
Another rave for Washington from Joe Dziemianowicz of the New York Daily News. Mixed on the play, and dislikes some of the performances (he thinks David Morse is miscast). Likes Colm Meany, Tammy Blanchard and Michael Potts, but rates the play mainly for Washington's performance www.nydailynews.com/entertainment/theater-arts/iceman-cometh-review-denzel-washington-top-shelf-boozy-saga-article-1.3956330New York Daily News ‘Iceman Cometh’ review: Denzel Washington top-shelf in boozy saga BY JOE DZIEMIANOWICZ NEW YORK DAILY NEWS Thursday, April 26, 2018, 7:30 PM As Hickey, Denzel Washington goes from life of the party to illusion-busting lout. (JULIETA CERVANTES) Let’s get straight to the burning question about Broadway’s “The Iceman Cometh,” Eugene O’Neill’s 1946 booze-soaked saga of curdled lives and dashed dreams: Does marquee attraction Denzel Washington delivereth the goods? You bet — and then some. The Oscar- and Tony-winner stars as Theodore (Hickey) Hickman, an alcohol- and whore-loving hardware peddler. His visits to a New York dive bar in 1912 give its denizens — bartenders, former military men, dime-store philosophers, lawyers, revolutionaries and hookers — a reason to celebrate. But the party’s over. An hour into the play, Hickey shows up and reveals that he’s on the wagon — and that they all need to snap out of their illusions. His pickled pals can’t handle it. Washington has shiny star quality and 100-proof charisma that fits like a glove for Hickey, who’s a sort of celebrity to these barflies. But the performance goes beyond mere surface gloss and a glued-on smile that covers many sins, including ones about Hickey’s wife. Denzel Washington, as Hickey, whose permasmile masks desperation and deep self-loathing. (JULIETA CERVANTES) The salesman reveals those late in the play at the Jacobs Theatre. Seated in a chair and facing the audience — a smart choice by director George C. Wolfe — Hickey digs deep and tells all. We’re glued to every word. It’s what you hope for in the theater. Otherwise, Wolfe’s staging is a mixed bag. Part of that is because the play is so long, talky and repetitive. You feel its four hours, especially when design-wise there’s little to lose oneself in and performances aren’t all top-shelf. Alas, they’re not. That includes a key one by Washington’s former “St. Elsewhere” co-star David Morse. He plays the pivotal role of an ex-anarchist who’s had it with revolution and life. Miscast, Morse is too wispy and lacks gravity and gets the show off to a clunky start. Brian Dennehy’s richer take on the part in a Brooklyn run three years ago opposite Nathan Lane as Hickey kept coming into my head. But there are also bright spots in the new production, including Colm Meaney’s touching take on the ironically named bar owner Harry Hope. Tammy Blanchard makes the tough tart Cora someone to root for. And Michael Potts’ fiery work as a black man fed up with white exploitation stands out. “The Iceman Cometh” is the last show of the 2017-2018 Broadway season to open. In the end, the play is about Hickey — and Washington. We’ll drink to that. |
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Post by pupdurcs on Apr 27, 2018 0:58:25 GMT
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Post by pupdurcs on Apr 27, 2018 1:05:12 GMT
Another rave for Washington from AmNY's Matt Windman. Calls Washington "superb", "first rate" and "unapologetically unsettling". Likes the ensemble, thinks direction a bit self-conscious, but play succeeds mainly due to cast. www.amny.com/entertainment/the-iceman-cometh-review-1.18271485ENTERTAINMENT ‘The Iceman Cometh’ review: Denzel Washington is superb in excellent O’Neill revival Terrific ensemble cast join the star under George C. Wolfe’s direction. By Matt Windman amNewYork Theater Critic Updated April 26, 2018 7:30 PM ‘The Iceman Cometh’ runs through July 1 at Bernard B. Jacobs Theatre, 242 W. 45th St., icemanonbroadway.com According to Eugene O’Neill’s written character descriptions for “The Iceman Cometh,” Theodore Hickman (i.e. Hickey), the big-spending, jovial hardware salesman who lights up Harry Hope’s dingy West Village saloon and cheers up his downtrodden inhabitants, is heavyset, bald, short, round-faced and button-nosed. In order words, Hickey (played by Nathan Lane three years ago at BAM) would not appear to be a role destined for Denzel Washington — yet here he is on Broadway giving a first-rate performance in a first-class revival of O’Neill’s titanic 1946 tragedy of shattered dreams, hopelessness and inebriation. Under the focused direction of George C. Wolfe, the play has been cut down from five to four hours in length — which is not an unwelcome change given that the script is lumbering and repetitious (including its endless “pipe dream” references). Set in 1912, Harry (Colm Meaney, “Star Trek: Deep Space Nine”) and his customers (many living in ramshackle tenements above the bar) are eagerly anticipating a rare visit from Hickey. Upon Hickey’s entrance (approximately an hour after the play begins), the gang can sense that something about him is off. In an evangelical and twisted state of mind, Hickey announces that he is now sober and happier, having rid himself of all “pipe dreams.” Not only that, he is determined to make converts out of everyone else. He will force them to leave the bar and reclaim their shattered lives. Larry Slade (David Morse, “St. Elsewhere”), a political anarchist turned cynic who is essentially a stand-in for O’Neill, becomes suspicious of Hickey’s personality change, which eventually leads to uncomfortable revelations from Hickey about the fate of his wife (who, Hickey likes to joke, regularly cheats on him with the iceman), culminating in a long confessional monologue. Wolfe is often too self-conscious in his direction, fiddling with the set design (the back wall is missing, the ceiling suddenly materializes, a piano player is unnecessarily added) and blocking (often having the cast fixed in frozen tableaux). Nevertheless, the production succeeds largely on account of a terrific ensemble (which also includes Frank Wood, Bill Irwin, Michael Potts, Tammy Blanchard and Austin Butler) in great character roles. A clear contrast is made between them and Washington, who is physical, pugnacious and unapologetically unsettling as Hickey. |
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sirchuck23
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Post by sirchuck23 on Apr 27, 2018 1:39:39 GMT
Looks like Denzel is 3 for 3 as far as great acclaim for his Broadway outings this decade with these reviews. Robert Hofler of The Wrap called the production "revelatory" and said its the strongest case for the Actors' Equity petitioning the Tony Awards to add a Best Ensemble category. He compared the performance favorably to Glenda Jackson's (currently in Three Tall Women) critically raved performance towards the end and said the both of them performing right next to each other would cause an earthquake on West 45th street..lol. Love the hyperbole. www.thewrap.com/iceman-cometh-broadway-review-denzel-washington-mission/Charles Isherwood, former NY Times theater critic, said the play was "shatteringly good" and that Denzel, who he considers "one of Broadway's finest leading men", memorably delivers a towering performance, suggesting that his was the first Hickey rendition he can remember where the surface Hickey moves into a "trap of madness" from the trap of his life. broadway.news/2018/04/26/review-denzel-washington-radiates-iceman-cometh/ Chris Jones of The Chicago Tribune called Denzel "stunning and mesmerizing" www.chicagotribune.com/entertainment/theater/broadway/ct-ae-iceman-jones-0429-story.htmlThink these reviews in general are good enough for Denzel to earn his 2nd Tony Award nod if not win. It'll be interesting to see next Tuesday, if he gets the nom. He got similarly good notices for A Raisin in the Sun and famously didn't get the nom. |
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Post by pupdurcs on Apr 27, 2018 1:53:32 GMT
Looks like Denzel is 3 for 3 as far as great acclaim for his Broadway outings this decade with these reviews. Robert Hofler of The Wrap called the production "revelatory" and said its the strongest case for the Actors' Equity petitioning the Tony Awards to add a Best Ensemble category. He compared the performance favorably to Glenda Jackson's (currently in Three Tall Women) critically raved performance towards the end and said the both of them performing right next to each other would cause an earthquake on West 45th street..lol. Love the hyperbole. www.thewrap.com/iceman-cometh-broadway-review-denzel-washington-mission/Charles Isherwood, former NY Times theater critic, said the play was "shatteringly good" and that Denzel, who he considers "one of Broadway's finest leading men", memorably delivers a towering performance, suggesting that his was the first Hickey rendition he can remember where the surface Hickey moves into a "trap of madness" from the trap of his life. broadway.news/2018/04/26/review-denzel-washington-radiates-iceman-cometh/ Chris Jones of The Chicago Tribune called Denzel "stunning and mesmerizing" www.chicagotribune.com/entertainment/theater/broadway/ct-ae-iceman-jones-0429-story.htmlThink these reviews in general are good enough for Denzel to earn his 2nd Tony Award nod if not win. It'll be interesting to see next Tuesday, if he gets the nom. He got similarly good notices for A Raisin in the Sun and famously didn't get the nom. Welcome back brother chuck  Honestly, while it would be disappointing if Washington didn't get the Tony nomination with these reviews (or contend for the win, which he really should be doing with these notices), I probably wouldn't lose that much sleep over it. As a fan, these notices are beautiful to read, but it's ultimately about the work. Washington is enshrining himself as one of the all-time great American stage actors, particularly as you said with his 3 for 3 run in the last decade. I think I said in another post, that he doesn't need more hardware at this point if he's aiming to go down as the best ever. He just has to take on the challenges and deliver. Which he's clearly doing. He's solidifying his stature as America's greatest living actor, and maybe by some distance (regardless of the medium), which is the big takeaway. What's he doing...what he's done, is kinda insane. |
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sirchuck23
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Post by sirchuck23 on Apr 27, 2018 2:09:38 GMT
Thank you sir!  Yeah, I agree its about the work and I'm just grateful that Washington as an A-List Hollywood leading man/movie star at this point is still trying to find and do challenging work and continue exploring the limits of his craft when he could easily rest on his laurels for the rest of his career. If he can't find the challenging roles on film, he'll do them on Broadway. It is interesting in the press event prior to the opening of The Iceman Cometh, Denzel mentioned that he felt he would ultimately end his career on the stage and that it was his "true love" as an actor. Looks like since he returned in 2005 he ultimately knew it would probably be where he finishes his career considering how the meaty roles would eventually dry up for actors his age and how hard, especially being a black actor, it would be for even him to find worthwhile parts with good directors. Roman J Israel is usually an oddity for him. As far as The Iceman Cometh, it is weird that looking at these reviews, the only part of the production so far getting noticed (as far as the Drama Desk Awards and Outer Critics Circle Awards) is David Morse, where he's not even the most raved performance. I know they're in different categories, but still its a little baffling looking at these reviews that he's the only thing about the production being singled out. |
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Post by stephen on Apr 27, 2018 2:14:43 GMT
Think these reviews in general are good enough for Denzel to earn his 2nd Tony Award nod if not win. It'll be interesting to see next Tuesday, if he gets the nom. He got similarly good notices for A Raisin in the Sun and famously didn't get the nom. These are all marvelous reviews, and I really envy anyone who gets to see this one, but let's not count our chickens before they hatch. Remember that some of y'all were saying it was a done deal in 2014 with A Raisin in the Sun back on IMDb. Despite his acclaim, Washington is still a bit of a Broadway outsider, and Best Actor looks tougher this year than it's been in quite some time. The reviews are great, and he benefits from recency, but the field looks mighty dense at the moment. With all that said, damned if these reviews don't make me wanna buy a ticket to NYC stat. It really pisses me off that so many great plays/performances become so hard to come by on physical media. |
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sirchuck23
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Bad news dawg...you don't mind if I have some of your 300 dollar a glass shit there would ya?
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Post by sirchuck23 on Apr 27, 2018 2:19:12 GMT
That's true. Next tuesday is going to be interesting. I won't be shocked if he doesn't get nominated again for The Iceman Cometh.
It's also very tempting to have to scrounge up some money to go see the production in NYC based on the reviews. I went to see him in 2014 for A Raisin in the Sun, and I definitely want to see this as well being a Washington fan.
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Post by pupdurcs on Apr 27, 2018 2:19:56 GMT
Thank you sir! Yeah, I agree its about the work and I'm just grateful that Washington as an A-List Hollywood leading man/movie star at this point is still trying to find and do challenging work and continue exploring the limits of his craft when he could easily rest on his laurels for the rest of his career. If he can't find the challenging roles on film, he'll do them on Broadway. It is interesting in the press event prior to the opening of The Iceman Cometh, Denzel mentioned that he felt he would ultimately end his career on the stage and that it was his "true love" as an actor. Looks like since he returned in 2005 he ultimately knew it would probably be where he finishes his career considering how the meaty roles would eventually dry up for actors his age and how hard, especially being a black actor, it would be for even him to find worthwhile parts with good directors. Roman J Israel is usually an oddity for him. As far as The Iceman Cometh, it is weird that looking at these reviews, the only part of the production so far getting noticed (as far as the Drama Desk Awards and Outer Critics Circle Awards) is David Morse, where he's not even the most raved performance. I know they're in different categories, but still its a little baffling looking at these reviews that he's the only thing about the production being singled out. The Morse thing is bizarre, as I'm not seeing him being singled out much in these reviews (aside from some saying he's miscast or lacking in energy). Hopefully the actual Tony nominating commitee go by reviews, rather than whatever was going on before the play officially opened. Very good points about Washington looking to stage for the meatiest roles because maybe he realised how much harder it would get for him to get those great film roles as he aged. We were having this conversation on another thread recent about how Daniel Day-Lewis, post 60 years old, would supposedly struggle to get leading oscar calibre roles (unless he developed them himself). And DDL is a white man, and no matter what age you are, a white male actor will always get more quality roles written for him in Hollywood than anyone else. Washington is a unique individual in Hollywood, and he may somehow get opportunties created for him (like Dan Gilroy did) but even he must be worried that the great film roles won't be forthcoming as he moves into his mid 60's. ESpecially considering how many of the great autuers who routinely praised him (ie Scorsese) never bothered actually creating any roles for him. |
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Post by stephen on Apr 27, 2018 2:26:10 GMT
I want to posit a theory: let's say that Washington misses next Tuesday. I'd be very curious if, provided it makes a Broadway bow next year, Cranston also misses for Network for what I'd argue are raves on par with Denzel's. Could the Tony voters look at guys like Washington and Cranston and go, "Well, those film/TV guys came in, kicked ass, but we already rewarded them once"?
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Post by pacinoyes on Apr 27, 2018 10:34:29 GMT
I'd say that is an interesting question but not really indicative of how dishonest the Tony's are - for plays at least - they are far more likely to size up the current season and use the TV/movie stars - even stage veterans like Washington - for their own purposes too. You always hear about stars "using" the theater but its also about how the theater and its Tony voting body use stars as much as stars use them.
Cranston's piece is an original play (based on the film but he originated it) - so if he pulls it off next year it carries a cache to it - its what I said before that you really can't just do the classics like Washington is doing here with 3 classic roles in about 8 years. It starts to look like a greatest hits tour every time he comes back.
Now I love O'Neill and am seeing Washington and Brian Dennehy did this sort of "star does the classics" (and won 2 in a short amount of time for Death of A Salesman, Long Day's Journey Into Night) but in general its tough to do because the Tony's see stars as pulling an explicit star move by doing them - and Dennehy is no Washington as a draw.
The Cranston move if he does it (big if) more resembles Rylance's "I'll do anything whenever I want and you won't know how to take it" ethos more than what Dennehy and Washington are doing in the above examples - that's not a put down but it is a whole different thing and subject to a whole different kind of Tony voting hypocrisy too. He's not Rylance but he's also not playing Big Daddy in Cat On A Hat Tin Roof or something like that either.
That's just something to keep in mind - eventually time gets to you, pupdurcs said it best when he said Washington has done new plays before and now wants to do this - and I get it - but at this time Cranston (a stage newcomer) and Washington (an established pro) might be more different than the same even if they both end up with 2 Tony's..........
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Post by pupdurcs on Apr 27, 2018 12:30:21 GMT
The whole Cranston thing feels like pointless speculation at this point. Circumstances aren't comparable. If he originated Network on Broadway, then yes. But he'll be coming to Broadway with the "stamp of approval" of the UK theatre community thank to his Olivier win. Even if there is a natural resentment of huge film/TV stars on Broadway (and there is), Cranston's Olivier win is probably more than enough to counteract that.
But Washington's superstardom on film is not to his advantadge on Broadway (apart from selling tickets), when it comes to the awards season. He's won the Tony, but his win, though considered deserving, did engender some measure resentment among the Broadway rank and file, especially since a couple of other movie stars won Tonys as well in his year. Everyone knows he's a great stage actor. He's got a case for being the finest American stage actor working. But the man literally has everything. Won every award. Has hundreds of millions in the bank. As brilliant as he is, and make no mistake, the man is genius, on film and stage, he's not exactly someone that's easy to root for.
You only need to listen to Patti Lupone's recent evisceration of Uma Thurman for daring to star in a Broadway play this season (Thurman got less than stellar reviews) to realise how much festering resentment there is from Broadway regulars to film/TV stars who parachute in to do Broadway. Washington is massively respected by the Broadway community because he's the real deal on stage, but he's still an A-list movie star that's already won a Tony. Hard to root for.
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Post by pacinoyes on Apr 27, 2018 13:09:33 GMT
The issue with the Tony voting bodies and the other ones in NYC is how gross the theater community (yeah right) acts to support that resentment - the critics, writers are a relatively small body - like really small and what's worse it's where a few guys dictate the entire discussions - it is far worse than even the Oscars could ever be.
So, Washington may win a Tony for Fences but they can, for no other reason than "just because" he can not be nodded for A Raisin in The Sun or Iceman - I didn't see either, I'm just saying, it doesn't even matter if he is nodded even because it's not a fair playing field in how they have to address anyone of any level of fame - not just him but he's bigger - Billy Crudup, Kevin Kline, Langella, James Earl Jones - anyone is subject to the capricious whims.
If "anyone" happens to be a Best Actor Oscar and Tony winner - and basically that's almost nobody, Washington, Rush, Pacino, Irons - um? - watch out because it's just another ingredient to the mix and the mindset. You have to just go by the work if you're lucky enough to see it - I've seen Tony winning performances that didn't deserve it, some that overwhelmingly did, but the process sucked for them both - and a stopped clock is right twice a day anyway - it won't change.
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Post by pacinoyes on Apr 30, 2018 21:07:41 GMT
Here is a perfect example of what I meant earlier by the theater community supporting that "resentment" - this is a very badly written review - its not going to affect Washington's Tony nomination or the play or the perception of his performance, but I'm posting this as an example of the arrogance of the theater critic community (Brantley does this a lot too btw). The critic here attacks not just the performance, that's fine you can find bad reviews for any performance. No, what he's doing here rather is specifically attacking the actor for the gall in his performance given his stature - for his film success and its not valid - not that his POV on the work isn't valid (I haven't seen it) but where the review is coming from isn't coming from a valid place overall. It's always a pity when a critic cynically sticks to what he knows will work too...... "When his Hickey speaks, at the end of the play, of how intolerable his wife’s love was to him, he isn’t consumed by sickening guilt and the stink of his shitty nerves; instead, he sits back in his chair, putting his jacket on, then taking it off again, like a star doing what he has to do to remind audiences that, after all, he has won two Oscars. It’s always a pity when an actor cynically sticks to what he knows will work and leaves it at that."
www.newyorker.com/magazine/2018/05/07/eugene-oneills-unhappy-hour |
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Post by pupdurcs on Apr 30, 2018 22:24:47 GMT
Ehhh... I suppose I see that you are trying to make a point of sorts, who really cares about one negative or so-so performance review in a sea of mostly raves? The same critic Hilton Als, gave a very similar review to Glenda Jackson in Three Tall Women, and she's supposed to be the frontrunner in her category. Maybe he's just feeling contrarian, and it's his right. It's not really worth giving any attention to. The major critics aren't the ones who are the problem as far as I can tell. They are the reasons big guns like Washington and Jackson are heavily in the mix. I actually got bored of posting more postive reviews, because the superlatives (particularly for Washington) weren't stopping, like this one from Newsweek. www.newsweek.com/denzel-washington-iceman-cometh-review-broadway-904552REVIEW: DENZEL WASHINGTON GIVES TOP-SHELF PERFORMANCE IN ‘ICEMAN COMETH’ REVIVAL BY JOE WESTERFIELD Eugene O’Neill’s classic play The Iceman Cometh is getting a powerful revival at the Bernard B. Jacobs Theatre in New York City. At the center of the action is Denzel Washington, who plays Hickey, a role that has become the American equivalent of Lear or Hamlet, one that tests a performer’s stamina as well as his acting talent. Hickey was made famous by Jason Robards in 1956 and has since been performed by the top stage actors of their generation, such as James Earl Jones, Kevin Spacey and Nathan Lane. And Washington is more than up to the test, giving a Tony-caliber performance. |
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Post by pacinoyes on Apr 30, 2018 22:53:13 GMT
The same critic Hilton Als, gave a very similar review to Glenda Jackson in Three Tall Women, and she's supposed to be the frontrunner in her category. maybe he's just feeling contrarian. That sort of proves my point if true given she's a two time Oscar winner too doesn't it? - You can write this same review of Iceman and leave out "2 time Oscar winner" to get his point across - but his point, rather, is clearly something else - that's why he includes it. In a positive review when they are glad handing the Oscar winner (which happens too), you can smell it out easily - but in a negative review where they do the equivalent as a punitive device it's harder to spot? I mean, you just said there is a backlash against Oscar winners or successful film actors in your Patti Lupone example and here you have a clear example and don't see it? You "suppose" you "see" I'm "trying" to make a point "of sorts"? How can I be more clear? |
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Post by pupdurcs on Apr 30, 2018 23:10:37 GMT
When did I say there was a backlash against Oscar winners? I don't think there's any such thing. Film actors new to Broadway (especially without much theatre background) can be treated with suspicion of course, but if they perform well, critics are generally inclined to be kind (like Chris "Captain America" Evans in Lobby Hero this season). It's actually Broadway workers (ie actors) who tend to have the biggest problem, as it's their jobs that are threatened. A theatre critics job isn't threatened by a film or TV actor. Patti Lupone attacking a fellow actor is a much bigger deal to me than a critic being unkind in a review.
Like I said, this guy is one critic. it's like judging all film critics by Armond White. If it was a more widespread problem with major critics, I'd pay it mind. But in a year when actors mainly known for their film celebrity are considered frontrunners thanks to positive ink from said critics, it'd be churlish to say critics are treating them unfairly. Mabybe someone like Pacino has had a rough time of it from critics in recent outings, but I'm not sure that's related to his film stardom or celebrity.
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Post by pacinoyes on Apr 30, 2018 23:30:02 GMT
I've copied what you wrote below, and I guess we disagree then, and I misunderstood because to me the problems with the theater critics is the main problem in New York Theater - and it buttresses Lupone's behavior.
They foster an awful Tony nominating process, awful "precursors" awards (which aren't really precursors), awful, unethical ticket gouging in conjunction with high powered productions. I guess we just disagree but to me it isn't comparable to film at all - film critics have almost no sway on box office - Armond White or a million Armnd White's - Broadway is a built in monopoly, whole different thing.....
You only need to listen to Patti Lupone's recent evisceration of Uma Thurman for daring to star in a Broadway play this season (Thurman got less than stellar reviews) to realise how much festering resentment there is from Broadway regulars to film/TV stars who parachute in to do Broadway. Washington is massively respected by the Broadway community because he's the real deal on stage, but he's still an A-list movie star that's already won a Tony. Hard to root for.
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Post by pacinoyes on May 4, 2018 10:18:49 GMT
A quite good production that works in some ways you wouldn't think too - almost every choice in staging and performance works overall - at least the big ones do.
First, the play is cut I think mostly in the middle, but since I can't tell specifically that's a good thing except in the transitions and switchings between characters - overall, energetic production and only a little hectic and cluttered.
No effort to explain Hickey being black which works too - where you might overcompensate for that in the staging and how you position him and interact him it works well the complete other way here by staging things as a grand party atmosphere. Washington also doesn't try to take race out of Hickey either which helps - there is very much much a "gospel" quality to his performance which fits the character.
The biggest risk though is key scene is staged in a way that at first looks ridiculous - almost speaking directly to the audience (how's he going to interact with the cast here?) but that actually works too - it removes Hickey in a way which fits - after all they are observers and listeners too - and he is extremely skillful in the speech. I didn't see much madness in him though - in fact he plays it rather like the madness that was there left him crippled him emotionally - but he's a lot warmer and more overtly emotional. It's a different sort of Hickey and while I'd like to see the madness still be there, he is still very recognizable as the character you'd know from the text.
Rest of the crew were entertaining to in one case, awful - love Bill Irwin (a Tony winner too) and he was a great presence though again the cuts maybe effect those peripheral characters more and in one case or maybe two really hurt it - the Don Parritt character is completely marginalized and that's a shocking thing in this play - and I didn't think the actor playing him was good either - the Iceman Cometh for him too. Where is his fear and sadness - you can see this play and not even grasp his importance here.
David Morse was fine but not particularly distinctive as what's nearly the co-lead of Larry Slade, he mostly just looks glum. Colm Meaney was a smart and memorable Harry Hope - almost seething, when is this booze going to do its job? - he gets the cruel irony functioning here - he's the flip side of the party vibe.
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Post by pupdurcs on May 5, 2018 2:48:23 GMT
Interesting takeaway from this review. Sounds like Washington has a real chance of bagging the Tony. His percieved snub for Raisin In The Sun may give him a crucial edge if the race is tight. Andrew Garfield may end up cursing his luck that Washington came last out the gate to a performance this rapturously recieved. theaterpizzazz.com/the-iceman-cometh/
This Iceman Cometh is all about Denzel. He’s the reason large swaths of the audience (many evidently unfamiliar with O’Neill) buy tickets, and the play is edited to make it his showcase (which will likely result in him landing a number of Best Actor awards). This focus appears to be frustrating for some of the other actors, as quite a number try to step up their performances to stay on par with Washington. That’s a mistake, because it takes them out of character and diminishes the play’s overall message. Nonetheless, the overall production is solid and well delivered, despite it being a must-see based solely on Washington’s performance in such an iconic, classic role. |
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Post by pacinoyes on May 5, 2018 9:31:08 GMT
Hollander and Parker opened roughly same time as well (equal reviews and weirdly iconic-in a different way. Travesties is a winning role though I don't know the play myself but it has won previous to Hollander it should be noted)
Hickey isn't really that much of an "iconic, classic a role" - for example, like we have said it's never won for that role - and the play while having an actors cache isn't performed that much either - but it is a classic role in its own way and has grown in stature over the years like O'Neill has overall - in theory you could have 4 classic roles in it - potentially depending on the production.
That is also what makes the Irons/Manville piece so exciting too because most playwrights don't get 2 high profile plays in their canon (much less at the same time, much less with 2 Oscar/Tony Winning Male leads - there's only a few of those alive period - much less so close together - AND just a short drive away!)
My girlfriend's friend by the way worked on the sound (as one of the college kids that help the production) and was telling us that Washington came out and talked to all of them about their careers and the light people and stage design etc. - which is apparently quite rare - she works on a lot of plays and it sometimes happens but not much and that he was very nice and gracious to them all and talked for a good bit.
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Post by pupdurcs on May 5, 2018 10:33:45 GMT
I'd say Hickey is unequivocally a classic and iconic role in American theatre. Probably top 5 overall. And top 3 for men (one could argue it's at the very top). There are a handful of them for males in particular. Willy Loman, Stanley Kowalski, James Tyrone, Walter Lee Younger, Troy Maxon, Eddie Carbone. Hickey is right up there, without question. That Washington has aced 3 of the signature roles in American theatrical history is no small feat.
Not winning for the role doesn't mean it's not an unequivocal classic, iconic role. Stanley Kowalski has never won a Tony for any actor who played the part, yet it's regarded without question as one of the great male parts in American theatre history. The role call of actors over the years who have stepped up to the challenge of Hickey is actually more impressive than those who have done Stanley. Jason Robards, Kevin Spacey, Brian Dennehy, Nathan Lane, James Earl Jones. Nobody undertakes this role on stage without having serious, serious theatre chops. It's a roll call of American stage greats. It's a titanic part. Stanley Kowalski is a great role, but you don't need to be at as high a level as a stage actor to take it on, which maybe explains why there have been more "lesser" actors wiling to engage the role. Pretty much only Tony winning actors play Hickey.
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Post by pacinoyes on May 5, 2018 11:36:38 GMT
Usually the roles that get assigned that tag are the same as like great film directors. That why say no one picked Mulholland Drive as the best movie of its year but over time the director is deemed important so the work is too (or PTA with The Master etc.)
In theater it would have been unheard of to say Hickey and James Tyrone are both in the elite league at one time (recently too) because the playwright wasn't ranked THAT highly for a long time.......as O'Neill has grown, so too the stature of the roles. But they are not that easy to define - Hickey does not do much in the middle of the play, the role is great, I love it, but even taking your Stanley Kowalski example - that role is a defined archetype in performance - so it's Brando as Stanley far more than the role itself.
Not winning a Tony for the role doesn't mean it not an unequivocal classic, but rather I'm saying that word is tossed around way too much and it's too time sensitive depending on a variety of factors - time, productions (not just Broadway) - I mean, basically anybody who plays Roy Cohn (and Prior is actually the far greater role) wins an award, that just doesn't have as much time behind it for people to conflate it with the "iconic classic" roles.
I remember that when Michael Corrente was trying to convince Dustin Hoffman to take the role of Teach in American Buffalo - he told him if I recall correctly - one day, there will be 3 great roles in the theater Teach, Willy Loman, and Hamlet - you've done one, you're too old for the other, so........" Now that sounds ridiculous, but it's hard to say 50 years from now (or for Shelley Levene, or Ricky Roma or Bobby Gould, or Lenny and George or.....), that's what makes it interesting...
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