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Post by notacrook on Jul 21, 2017 16:39:12 GMT
Ah fuck it, I can't wait for this shit.
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Post by DeepArcher on Jul 21, 2017 17:04:17 GMT
"I believe you have a role to play, as does another." Here we go... Not a fan of the Jon/Dany alliance? Not in the slightest. I dislike the concept to begin with, but it's made even worse by the fact that it's painfully predictable at this point.
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Post by notacrook on Jul 21, 2017 17:20:40 GMT
Not a fan of the Jon/Dany alliance? Not in the slightest. I dislike the concept to begin with, but it's made even worse by the fact that it's painfully predictable at this point. True, but isn't it almost a narrative necessity? They eventually need to band together in the fight against the White Walkers, and before that they need to defeat Cersei. I think it makes things less messy and cluttered if they become allies and merge their storylines together, predictable though it is. I just hope they don't start a romance. Now that would piss me off.
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Post by DeepArcher on Jul 21, 2017 17:27:00 GMT
Not in the slightest. I dislike the concept to begin with, but it's made even worse by the fact that it's painfully predictable at this point. True, but isn't it almost a narrative necessity? They eventually need to band together in the fight against the White Walkers, and before that they need to defeat Cersei. I think it makes things less messy and cluttered if they become allies and merge their storylines together, predictable though it is. I just hope they don't start a romance. Now that would piss me off.Agreed! And no, I don't see it as a "necessity" to the narrative. To me, it feels like a cheap way to write themselves out of the story. The whole idea of "good" banding together to combat "evil" is very un- Game of Thrones; it's a long-standing storytelling trope, but it makes sense in other stories. Game of Thrones has never been a good vs. evil narrative, and taking it in that direction feels wrong to the story. I'd much prefer a far more creative direction to be taken in regards to the conclusion, not to mention the development of 'Mad Queen' Daenerys and further exploration of Jon Snow's corruptible morality. That would be far more interesting to me than the direction they seem to be headed in, but it all could be one big red herring.
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Post by notacrook on Jul 21, 2017 17:33:59 GMT
True, but isn't it almost a narrative necessity? They eventually need to band together in the fight against the White Walkers, and before that they need to defeat Cersei. I think it makes things less messy and cluttered if they become allies and merge their storylines together, predictable though it is. I just hope they don't start a romance. Now that would piss me off.Agreed! And no, I don't see it as a "necessity" to the narrative. To me, it feels like a cheap way to write themselves out of the story. The whole idea of "good" banding together to combat "evil" is very un- Game of Thrones; it's a long-standing storytelling trope, but it makes sense in other stories. Game of Thrones has never been a good vs. evil narrative, and taking it in that direction feels wrong to the story. I'd much prefer a far more creative direction to be taken in regards to the conclusion, not to mention the development of 'Mad Queen' Daenerys and further exploration of Jon Snow's corruptible morality. That would be far more interesting to me than the direction they seem to be headed in, but it all could be one big red herring. Yeah, they're alliance certainly isn't all that interesting or creative, but honestly I've kind of stopped expecting D&D to come up with anything bold like that (though if it's from Martin's supposed outlines, there could be hope). I was really interested in a 'Mad Queen' evolution for Daenerys, but I really don't see that happening this late in the story, since she's still being depicted as basically the epitome of all things good whose ruthless streak is constantly being quelled by Tyrion's wisdom. I wouldn't say it's an entirely 'good vs evil' plot with Cersei - she's probably the show's most complex character at this point, though she could easily slip into that lazy Ramsay role with lazy writing (which, lets face it, is an increasingly big problem with GoT).
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Post by Archie on Jul 24, 2017 2:01:10 GMT
Wtf I love Euron now
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Post by Archie on Jul 24, 2017 2:18:10 GMT
Give Alfie Allen an Emmy pls
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Post by DeepArcher on Jul 24, 2017 2:20:50 GMT
Some quick thoughts before I jump on tonight's Twin Peaks: --As someone who has already spoken-out about my qualms with the obvious Jon and Dany alliance, I will say that the way it's being handled so far isn't bad, in that: a.) Jon's departure opens up all kind of intriguing possibilities for Sansa (and Littlefinger) to take Winterfell; and b.) His traveling to Dragonstone further prolongs his reunion with Arya, which still may never happen. While I'm still not sold on the concept of the alliance, I think there are some fascinating directions it could be taken in, so I'm still interested enough. --The opening scene had the most bizarre execution ever. The way they abruptly go from discussing battle strategy to Dany absolutely failing to intimidate Varys is just an extremely awkward progression of events. Dany's inquiring into him really should have happened far sooner. In general, there's no reason why this scene could not have been two separate ones. --Yet again, no one cares about Grey Worm's and Missandei's romance. And that scene was soooo unnecessarily elongated. At least Nathalie Emmanuel is always --Are we finally gonna see Casterly Rock? Nice! --Loved that they went all-in in making Jorah's greyscale effectively grisly. Though the scene with Sam's procedure was also drawn-out far too long to the point of becoming much too awkward. And that cut to the pie ... just stupid. --Jon threatening Littlefinger in the crypts was nice albeit fan service-y. Kit was very good in this episode, and he showed impressive vulnerability in his "I didn't ask to be King" (or however he words it) scene. --I was looking forward to Arya's Nymeria reunion more than seeing her reunite with the family, honestly. It was obvious that it would happen, but I'm still glad that it did, even if the scene itself was nothing special. I'm also a bit confused to as what her last line ("That's not you.") was supposed to mean, exactly. I think I know what she meant, but I feel like there's something I wasn't picking up on. Also, in regards to Arya, it was a bit weird to see no follow-up with Ed Sheeran & gang. Though I'll likely never complain about a Hot Pie appearance. --Ellaria's "foreign invasion is coming" line ... --The last sequence squandered some great potential for an epic Greyjoy vs. Greyjoy naval battle. The action sequence itself wasn't bad (it was really well-shot), but I thought they could've led that in far more interesting directions. Euron is continuing to be the most ridiculous character ever, though seeing him cut down a couple of Sand Snakes was one of the most satisfying things I've ever seen on this show. It's a bit underwhelming that his "gift" to Cersei is just Ellaria (and Yara?). Also, Theon's jumping ship moment rang horribly false to his character at this point in his arc. Perhaps he has a plan to follow the ship or something? I don't know. They need to course-correct what they're doing with his character fast, because I do not want to see a Stannis 2.0. I'm still enjoying this season's approach to actually properly setting things up rather than throwing us right into the action with little time left to tell the story. The pacing so far has been strong, for the most part, and hopefully they can sustain that throughout the season. One of my biggest gripes with the first two episodes is the excessive sidelining of characters, as if many of them are being phased out of relevancy to the story rather than getting proper conclusions to their arcs. But we'll see. The story is also moving in predictable directions, but I'm still enticed enough to be looking forward to what happens next.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2017 2:32:21 GMT
Hot Pie: 10/10
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Post by theycallmemrfish on Jul 24, 2017 2:46:33 GMT
Great first half (thank you for giving Hill some quality stuff to work with), but a somewhat lackluster second. I'll detail a little more when it fully sinks in...
But before I forget, was anyone else noticing a lot of weird angles/close-ups this episode? I felt like there were more than a few off-putting shots and that's a little unusual for this show that usually has some very nice visuals.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2017 3:00:40 GMT
But before I forget, was anyone else noticing a lot of weird angles/close-ups this episode? I felt like there were more than a few off-putting shots and that's a little unusual for this show that usually has some very nice visuals. Yeah, I noticed that as well. Also some abrupt transitions.
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Post by theycallmemrfish on Jul 24, 2017 3:02:54 GMT
But before I forget, was anyone else noticing a lot of weird angles/close-ups this episode? I felt like there were more than a few off-putting shots and that's a little unusual for this show that usually has some very nice visuals. Yeah, I noticed that as well. Also some abrupt transitions. Oh yeah. I felt like the throne room scene with Cersei and the southern lords was just chock full of both especially.
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Post by Archie on Jul 24, 2017 3:11:08 GMT
Theon's jumping ship moment rang horribly false to his character at this point in his arc. Perhaps he has a plan to follow the ship or something? I don't know. They need to course-correct what they're doing with his character fast, because I do not want to see a Stannis 2.0. Theon made the best decision. He was dead if he stayed and Euron would've killed Yara if he attempted to rescue her.
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Post by theycallmemrfish on Jul 24, 2017 3:12:30 GMT
Theon's jumping ship moment rang horribly false to his character at this point in his arc. Perhaps he has a plan to follow the ship or something? I don't know. They need to course-correct what they're doing with his character fast, because I do not want to see a Stannis 2.0. Theon made the best decision. He was dead if he stayed and Euron would've killed Yara if he attempted to rescue her. Maybe I saw it wrong, but wasn't Yara hanging from the front of the ship?
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Post by Archie on Jul 24, 2017 3:15:55 GMT
Theon made the best decision. He was dead if he stayed and Euron would've killed Yara if he attempted to rescue her. Maybe I saw it wrong, but wasn't Yara hanging from the front of the ship? That was Nymeria Sand.
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Post by DeepArcher on Jul 24, 2017 3:33:36 GMT
But before I forget, was anyone else noticing a lot of weird angles/close-ups this episode? I felt like there were more than a few off-putting shots and that's a little unusual for this show that usually has some very nice visuals. Definitely. A lot of intense close-ups that lingered for an unnecessarily long time. Some very strange editing and cinematography in this episode, for sure.
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Post by DeepArcher on Jul 24, 2017 3:35:32 GMT
Theon made the best decision. He was dead if he stayed and Euron would've killed Yara if he attempted to rescue her. I feel like he was still risking that Euron may have killed her after he jumped overboard. I mean, he couldn't have been certain that he wouldn't have done that. I'm honestly somewhat surprised that he didn't.
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Post by Billy_Costigan on Jul 24, 2017 3:57:10 GMT
I haven't finished the books but since they (apparently) botched the whole Sand Snakes storyline, I don't mimd them going out now. Narratively, it makes sense for Euron to give Cersie the gift of revenge and weaken Dany's army by taking out a part of it.
And people saying Dany and Jon alliance is predictable... well duh. They are the two most important characters. It needs to happen and I like how they are handling it so far.
And we will finally see Casterly Rock??? 🤗
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Post by notacrook on Jul 24, 2017 4:36:47 GMT
On the whole, another very solid episode. This season is proving to be better than the previous two so far, with almost every scene feeling like it's pushing things forward, which is a nice change from the occasionally dull filler that plagued S5 and S6. I hope this quality continues. 8.5/10
Good: - I really liked that final battle sequence. It was nicely shot, and felt appropriately chaotic given that it was supposed to come out of nowhere. Euron continues to be utterly absurd and over-the-top, but eh whatever, I can live with him being a mad-man and nothing else - I never liked him in the books anyway, so it's not like they're butchering a favourite. I'm interested in how Dany and co. will deal with the fallout, since it's a pretty big blow.
- I liked the stuff with Daenerys this week. That Varys confrontation did indeed feel forced, and I would have thought she would have already done that by now, but still it was a good moment when contained to just itself. I'm glad the show is still taking the time to show political strategies instead of just throwing the characters into action at once. Not sure I'm liking Olenna as much now though. Advising Daenerys to ignore Tyrion doesn't seem all that smart as of right now.
- Hotpie! Nymeria! Arya's having a fantastic season so far, which she deserves after two awful ones. I need that Stark family reunion (I don't care about Bran, him not showing up was a huge plus). I'm confused by that final line too though.
- The Winterfell scenes continue to be the most intriguing and engaging, and now that Jon has left I'm very interested to see how Sansa will handle temporary ruling. Jon shutting Littlefinger down was great, Kit Harington has improved so much since those block-of-wood days of S1.
Bad: - While I liked the battle sequence, I definitely didn't like Theon literally jumping ship. I'm not writing it off as Stannis-level bullshit just yet, but it was hugely disappointing to see him back pedal after his great character arc.
- Ugh, Sam. Similarly to Bran, I get that this storyline is 'important' and all, but it's so boring. The gory details of Jorah's greyscale were nice though.
- Ah, Grey Worm and Missandei. The thing is, I think this could have been a really good little subplot, giving two minor characters some humanity and depth. The problem is they keep randomly going back to it every other season or so, so that there's no consistency and it just feels entirely forced. However, despite the fact that I'm not exactly into that kinda thing, Nathalie Emmanuel is pretty damn fine.
- I know it was only like 10 seconds long, but any scene where the Sand Snakes have dialogue and are the focal point is automatically painful. It's clear the writers took note of the mass hate on them, but I don't understand why they chose to go all in on their ridiculousness, instead of trying to salvage them in some way.
- Finally, I agree with you guys that there was some weird shots and transitions here, odd for such a well-produced show. Kinda distracting.
MVP: Maisie Williams
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Post by Pavan on Jul 24, 2017 8:45:51 GMT
Awesome episode, weirdly shot though. It's not the typical GoT style making. Anyway so many things happened.
Dany got much but Emilia Clarke needs to do better than that. I like the way they are handling Arya this season. So much better and that reunion with Nymeria.
As now Jon has left Winterfell, I'm a bit concerned about what Littlefinger will do to Sansa. Cersei and the King's landing stuff is boring.
The sex scene didn't feel a tiny bit steamy but Nathalie Emmmanuel is gorgeous.
The final battle came out of nowhere and i liked it. Euron is way over the top but I'm okay with that.
The show's moving fast and things are getting exciting. Can't wait for the next episode.
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Post by notacrook on Jul 24, 2017 11:10:34 GMT
The more I think on it, the more I think I actually did like Theon jumping ship. It fit his character better (he's turned good, not brave), it was a smarter move than making a run at Euron which would have no good outcome, and it was less cliched than if he had suddenly had a big hero moment - refreshing in a story that's becoming increasingly predictable. I'm still annoyed that he did it, but I don't think it was a bad move from a writing perspective.
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Post by stephen on Jul 24, 2017 12:20:16 GMT
Goddammit, are they pulling the same shit with Theon that they did with Sansa back in Season 5? Just when a character starts to reclaim agency on themselves, they are made a weak victim again? I think it would've been much more effective if Theon had made an attempt to save Yara, and that Euron (who finally became the Euron from the books tonight, I think; Asbaek has always been good but the writing hasn't quite nailed him down yet) mockingly knocks him overboard or something because he doesn't find "the cockless wonder" worth dirtying up his sword. Oh well, at least we're down a couple Sand Snakes.
Also, Conleth Hill was MVP tonight. His scene with Daenerys was brilliant.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2017 12:44:05 GMT
I legitimately vomited when he was removing Jorah's dragon scales.
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Post by Johnny_Hellzapoppin on Jul 24, 2017 17:40:32 GMT
Overall that was one of the best Game of Thrones episodes since the heady days of the first 4 years.
So relieved Arya is heading back to Winterfell, and in the absence of Jon, it'll be interesting to see her dynamics with Sansa, especially considering she's going to be dealing with a very different Sansa to the prissy tween she remembers. Hopefully, as I am so tired a Littlefinger, Arya might be given reason to do us all a favour. Shame Jon didn't wring his neck in those tombs, I'd have almost forgiven him for the previous 6 years.
One thing I found notably annoying is that Jon and Sansa didn't receive word from The Wall that their long lost brother who they haven't seen in years is back...seems a little stupid and unlikely. Game of Thrones writing is never stupid though, right.....
God help me next week, the meeting of my two least favourite characters of the seven years is on the cards, Jon and Dany together at last. If I don't pass some comment here by the middle of next week, presume I fell into a boredom induced coma.
I don't care any more about shitty Euron Greyjoy than I do about the shitty sandsnakes, so I really just rolled my eyes a lot during that battle, as important as it was.
I'm holding out hope that they aren't going to fuck up Theon's brilliant series long arc so far, I really don't think they will. Unlike TV Stannis who was a poor twin of the literary version, TV Theon is actually better in my eyes than his literary equivalent.
I'm liking the Citadel stuff, no complaints from me in that regard.
Dani v Varys was great, although, like others have said, a year too late.
The dull repetitiveness of his surrounding storyline, really has taken all the life from the character of Tyrion.
I was kinda digging Randall Tarly in his second appearance.
Cersei and Jaime - snooze
Olenna - snooze
Archmaester - bringing us the sass that Olenna presumably left in Highgarden
Hot Pie - good to have one of the good guys back
Melisandre - she was only gone for an episode and I missed her
Missandei and Greyworm - However sick of their scenes I am, there was something rather lovely about that one.
Audrey Horne - well I've given up hope of her showing up on Twin Peaks, so maybe here...Audrey Horne for the Iron Throne.
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Post by FrancescoAbides on Jul 24, 2017 19:27:30 GMT
Very good, consistent episode, reminding me a little bit of the first 4 Seasons, with some forced and unnecessary moments. Highlight of the episode: Shitty written Euron Greyjoy´s character (ironically compensated by Pilou´s "over-the-top" performance) going Mortal Kombat and killing two of those godawful Sand Snakes
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