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Post by hugobolso on Jan 13, 2023 18:04:42 GMT
I haven't seen the Fableman, and trully, I needs guts to see Spielberg childhood. I guess is the most boring plot I never seen. But after Lincoln, all Spielberg movies weren't as great, as suppose to be. Despite that he was usually nominee for techical awards, and specially for best Film and Best Director.
And I think Spielberg in the last 20 years (with a few exceptions like Lincoln) he is taking someones place that is more deserved.-
I think that for years there has been a disagreement between what the different award winners and critics say about Spielberg's films and what the audiences think. Well, it's been many years since people have seen the movies directed by Steven Spielberg en masse.
Francis Ford Coppola retired from the industry after the failure of Jack, making only independent films that no one records (not even his die hard critics fans).
Robert Altman for many years, it was said that he did not receive the Oscars or the nominations he deserved for not being a box office hit. Well, today that happens to Spielberg and yet they continue to nominate him. And many critics remained in the synopses of the childhood of the Spielberg of yesteryear, and they continue to applaud it no matter if the film is a mess.-
Any thoughts!!!
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Post by stephen on Jan 13, 2023 18:07:12 GMT
I mean, anyone who hits the vaunted heights that Spielberg has will inevitably draw criticisms of being overrated and overpraised. And I certainly think some of his movies are overpraised, and he does have some stinkers in his canon... but I also think he is underrated because so many people view him as a populist filmmaker and don't recognize that he is a true auteur and versatile master of the craft across varying genres. I actually think he's in the best phase of his career right now, starting with Lincoln onwards.
So yeah, I'd say he's more underrated than anything.
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Post by hugobolso on Jan 13, 2023 18:11:25 GMT
I mean, anyone who hits the vaunted heights that Spielberg has will inevitably draw criticisms of being overrated and overpraised. And I certainly think some of his movies are overpraised, and he does have some stinkers in his canon... but I also think he is underrated because so many people view him as a populist filmmaker and don't recognize that he is a true auteur and versatile master of the craft across varying genres. I actually think he's in the best phase of his career right now, starting with Lincoln onwards. So yeah, I'd say he's more underrated than anything. My question was a little tricky, I'm talking more about American Awards like the Oscars, SAG, Golden Globes, Critics Choice, Director Guild Awards, more than the perception of cinephiles.- I think that none of his last movies after Lincoln (and several movies after Saving Private Ryan) were at the same level than his classics like Jaws, ET, Close Encounters (my fave), Jurassic Park or Schindler list.- In fact I think they had recognition, because were expensive movies (after all, unfortunately most of the popular awards are about the bussiness awarded the bussiness) than for artistic aspect. Of course Spielberg had earn so much money, that could make the movies he wants, no matters if people actually will see. But I don't find Spielberg last movies at least experimental or inventive. Just a challange of reproduce old classics like All The President Men AKA The Post or West Side Story, without succeed.- I mean Spielberg palets colour are great in West Side Story, and the actress that portrays Anita is excellent (one of the few actors that won an oscar for a Spielberg movie). Otherwise is a pale comparison with the original, who wasn't a good movie either.- And the Post is as dull and Boring as Tin Tin or Horse War.- Horse War was nominated for best film, and Tin Tin wasn't because was realese the same year of Horse War. Otherwise, would be another Steven Spielberg Oscar Nominated Film, maybe even best director.-
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Post by stephen on Jan 13, 2023 18:19:23 GMT
I mean, anyone who hits the vaunted heights that Spielberg has will inevitably draw criticisms of being overrated and overpraised. And I certainly think some of his movies are overpraised, and he does have some stinkers in his canon... but I also think he is underrated because so many people view him as a populist filmmaker and don't recognize that he is a true auteur and versatile master of the craft across varying genres. I actually think he's in the best phase of his career right now, starting with Lincoln onwards. So yeah, I'd say he's more underrated than anything. My question was a little tricky, I'm talking more about American Awards like the Oscars, SAG, Golden Globes, Critics Choice, Director Guild Awards, more than the perception of the cinephiles.- I think that none of his last movies after Lincoln (and several movies after Saving Private Ryan) were at the same level.- I think Bridge of Spies is the best film he's made since Jaws, and Lincoln right behind. I don't care much for The BFG or Ready Player One, but those aren't really awards bait. The Post was surprisingly under-recognized but 2017 was an uncommonly strong year; if that movie is delayed a year it might have done much, much better. West Side Story did very well for such a late-breaker with screener issues, but I think it was always going to have difficulty achieving its own status against the 1961 classic, which was an Oscar juggernaut. And we still have yet to see where The Fabelmans will land. Spielberg's ubiquity and frequent consistency does work against him somewhat. He hasn't gone away for extended periods so that people can miss him the way they do for a lot of auteurs. People expect greatness and all the tools at his disposal because he commands such respect and clout in the industry that it's really going to take a huge game-changer from him to wow voters into going for him again. The Fabelmans is kind of that, in that it's basically the epitome of all of the classic Spielbergian tropes bundled into one package, but it's relatively small scope compared to his past accomplishments might work against him as well. I do think, however, this is the closest he's gotten to the big prize since the last time he won. Even with Lincoln, I think he was always in second place and the attention for that film lay at Day-Lewis's feet more than his.
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Post by ibbi on Jan 13, 2023 18:20:18 GMT
Altman and Coppola are/were outsiders, Spielberg is an insider. He's THE insider, and central to that industry. That they keep nominating him for awards when they love his movies makes all of the sense in the world. The man has reached mythic status.
Also, I think you're massively overstating his post-Lincoln popularity. Just because he has/is about to be, garlanded with nominations for two straight years shouldn't overlook the fact that between Lincoln and West Side Story he got one Globe nomination and one BAFTA nomination for director. None from Oscar, none from DGA.
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Post by pacinoyes on Jan 13, 2023 18:31:38 GMT
Awesome mastery of his craft ..........not much or a wrong-headed directorial vision at least - then applied onto his craft: He makes stuff I like - sorta.......but he doesn't have a movie in my top 100 or even my American Top 100 ....favorite or best..........I don't even know where he'd show up......I mean my favorite Spielberg movie is Munich ffs ........when most people consider him one of the best....if not "the best"........how can that not be overrated to me?
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Post by hugobolso on Jan 13, 2023 18:45:49 GMT
Altman and Coppola are/were outsiders, Spielberg is an insider. He's THE insider, and central to that industry. That they keep nominating him for awards when they love his movies makes all of the sense in the world. The man has reached mythic status. I'm not sure Coppola was an outsider. After all, his damn whole family still working in Hollywood and wining awards. But I agree that Spielberg is an insider. That they keep nominating him for awards when they love his movies makes all of the sense in the world. The man has reached mythic status. I have to desagree. In the past no matter, who the director was, usually only films that were money makers, or extremely beloved by critics, were Oscar Nominated as Best Picture or Best Director. The Academy could love Ford, Capra, Minelli, Wise or Cuckor. But if their film wasn't succesful at box office, their film wasn't nominated, and their directing effort were snubbed. Unless they were the trully critics darlings. Of course a bad film that wasn't succesful at box office could receive an Oscar for Best Picture, there are exceptions that made the rule.- But unless you are Stephen Daldry (and he had almost every british voter in his side) no box office success, not rave reviews, no Oscar Noms.- Also, I think you're massively overstating his post-Lincoln popularity. Just because he has/is about to be, garlanded with nominations for two straight years shouldn't overlook the fact that between Lincoln and West Side Story he got one Globe nomination and one BAFTA nomination for director. None from Oscar, none from DGA. I put Lincoln as an example. But this become after his big 1993 year. The trully division between Awards Seasons and Audiences started with Munich. Before that was pretty easy to understand why his movies have or haven't nominated for BP or BD oscars. Munich was another boring film against Nazi, that audiences disliked it, was a box office bomb, but the Academy and critics loved it.- Won only 47 m. in the States from a 70 m budget (overseas performed better but not much better). I think the story start with Munich. after an unnecesary Indie Jones movie, that still made tons of money.- Spielberg made War Horse and Tin Tin that were big box office bomb. And worse how Spielberg could direct dull and boring Adventure Movies. He had lost his touch. Then become the sparkle of Lincoln. And then he made movie for my parents to cure Insomnia. Of course he still a great craftmaker, that is easier for a tycoon who works with the best of the bussiness. But his time as author ended long time ago. And big Audiences are no longer waiting for his next movie.
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Post by stabcaesar on Jan 13, 2023 18:54:24 GMT
I feel like all of his movies are overrated. Of the ones I've seen anyway.
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Post by Pittsnogle_Goggins on Jan 13, 2023 18:55:25 GMT
No
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Post by Brother Fease on Jan 13, 2023 19:24:06 GMT
Overpraised? How is that? Spielberg has directed 30 films. She's made six since Lincoln. Pretty much all of his films were well-received.
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Post by quetee on Jan 13, 2023 19:55:05 GMT
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Post by JangoB on Jan 13, 2023 20:21:59 GMT
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Post by Brother Fease on Jan 13, 2023 20:50:45 GMT
I am with you. I am lost on what the poster is trying to argue.
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Post by hugobolso on Jan 13, 2023 21:22:22 GMT
I am with you. I am lost on what the poster is trying to argue. When your favorite best movie and director will be out and the Fabblemans and Spielberg will be in. Maybe then you can understand. The same will happend with the nominated actors of the Fabbleman, for being there in, someone will go out.
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Post by Brother Fease on Jan 13, 2023 21:42:02 GMT
When your favorite best movie and director will be out and the Fabblemans and Spielberg will be in. Maybe then you can understand. The same will happend with the nominated actors of the Fabbleman, for being there in, someone will go out. The Fabelmans is the title, not "Fabblemans". In Spanish, it is "Los Fabelman".
Still not understanding. What does this have to do with Spielberg being "overpraised"?
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Post by hugobolso on Jan 13, 2023 23:03:09 GMT
When your favorite best movie and director will be out and the Fabblemans and Spielberg will be in. Maybe then you can understand. The same will happend with the nominated actors of the Fabbleman, for being there in, someone will go out. The Fabelmans is the title, not "Fabblemans". In Spanish, it is "Los Fabelman".
Still not understanding. What does this have to do with Spielberg being "overpraised"?
Overpraised by the Academy and company. Thats the whole deal is the Academy and other Award Circles overpraising Spielberg last films, that hadnt the Audiences aprooval at box office. This isn't about Spielberg films from the late 60s to the early years of the new millenium. In the past Spielberg was underated, but I guess Spielberg last efforts are overated.
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Post by pacinoyes on Jan 13, 2023 23:07:58 GMT
Thoughts on his Mexican, non-union equivalent over the same period? Doesn't get the same budgets but slightly less mushy / sentimental
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Post by Brother Fease on Jan 13, 2023 23:13:09 GMT
The Fabelmans is the title, not "Fabblemans". In Spanish, it is "Los Fabelman".
Still not understanding. What does this have to do with Spielberg being "overpraised"?
Overpraised by the Academy and company.Thats the whole deal is the Academy and other Award Circles overpraising Spielberg last films, that hadnt the Audiences aprooval at box office. This isn't about Spielberg films from the late 60s to the early years of the new millenium. In the past Spielberg was underated, but I guess Spielberg last efforts are overated. When was the last time Spielberg won an Oscar? When was the last time a Spielberg film won Best Picture?
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VERITAS
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Post by VERITAS on Jan 13, 2023 23:32:23 GMT
Allow me to step outside of the "awards circuit" narrative of it all and just say that I think people need to take a deep dive into the work the man's put in behind the scenes as a producer (and the brains) for many iconic classics; Spielberg's collaboration with Don Bluth on An American Tail is just one of many projects he's had a massive creative hand in which I had no idea of until recently. I'm not one to laud the fuck outta him like most, but he undeniably deserves his "darling" status and I hold no grudges seeing him collect his flowers...
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Post by mikediastavrone96 on Jan 13, 2023 23:58:55 GMT
Nah. He's been awarded less than you'd think given his status and critical reception. Plus, this is one of the more interesting and self-reflexive periods of his career.
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filmnoir
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Post by filmnoir on Jan 14, 2023 0:20:54 GMT
And I think Spielberg in the last 20 years (with a few exceptions like Lincoln) he is taking someones place that is more deserved.-
I think that for years there has been a disagreement between what the different award winners and critics say about Spielberg's films and what the audiences think. Well, it's been many years since people have seen the movies directed by Steven Spielberg en masse.
No body ever takes anyone else's place. Most of his films would not have been made without him. Spielberg has only won Oscar Director twice and Picture once. And if it was up to audiences, the Marvel universe would have lots of Oscar wins.
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Film Socialism
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Post by Film Socialism on Jan 14, 2023 0:21:51 GMT
i've pretty much given up on him after his disastrous 2010s string. coppola has made some of his greatest work after Jack and pretty much every coppola fan i know agrees with that.
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Post by hugobolso on Jan 14, 2023 1:01:19 GMT
And I think Spielberg in the last 20 years (with a few exceptions like Lincoln) he is taking someones place that is more deserved.-
I think that for years there has been a disagreement between what the different award winners and critics say about Spielberg's films and what the audiences think. Well, it's been many years since people have seen the movies directed by Steven Spielberg en masse.
No body ever takes anyone else's place. Most of his films would not have been made without him. Spielberg has only won Oscar Director twice and Picture once. And if it was up to audiences, the Marvel universe would have lots of Oscar wins.
Maybe I get guuys lost in translation. This isnt about movies. This is about Academy Awards and their satélites Awards. Only 5 people will be nominated as best director. So if he isnt your personal top 5 (of the directions that had at least a slim Oscar Chances), he is taking somebody place. In films is exactly the same between 7 and 10 movies will be nominated. So if the Fabelmans isnt your personal on your top 10 is taking another movie place. Is the Director Guild Awards indulgent with Spielberg this year?, and last year?
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Post by Brother Fease on Jan 14, 2023 2:09:44 GMT
No body ever takes anyone else's place. Most of his films would not have been made without him. Spielberg has only won Oscar Director twice and Picture once. And if it was up to audiences, the Marvel universe would have lots of Oscar wins.
Maybe I get guuys lost in translation. This isnt about movies. This is about Academy Awards and their satélites Awards. Only 5 people will be nominated as best director. So if he isnt your personal top 5 (of the directions that had at least a slim Oscar Chances), he is taking somebody place. In films is exactly the same between 7 and 10 movies will be nominated. So if the Fabelmans isnt your personal on your top 10 is taking another movie place. Is the Director Guild Awards indulgent with Spielberg this year?, and last year? I am sorry, but I still don't understand your point. Are you saying The Fabelmans shouldn't be in the Picture - Director - Original Screenplay discussions because there are better films out there? You have admitted, you haven't seen The Fabelmans though.
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Post by Ryan_MYeah on Jan 14, 2023 2:47:26 GMT
I think this is assuming we put that much stock in the Oscars in the first place (Some of us take it too seriously). But even so, no. Certainly not overpraised in this period of his career.
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