Good God
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Post by Good God on Jul 12, 2021 16:32:57 GMT
One of the funniest things about movie economics. "We need to budget in the budget of other businesses so we can support their business while they all close down for our business." A lot of questions were asked about why Scorsese needed this much money for this movie, including by myself, but it's looking like they're going to great pains to ensure that they not only not detrimentally affect any of the local communities, but also pay them well for their technical work, crafts, and services.
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Post by stephen on Jul 12, 2021 16:46:06 GMT
One of the funniest things about movie economics. "We need to budget in the budget of other businesses so we can support their business while they all close down for our business." A lot of questions were asked about why Scorsese needed this much money for this movie, including by myself, but it's looking like they're going to great pains to ensure that they not only not detrimentally affect any of the local communities, but also pay them well for their technical work, crafts, and services. Even so, Gangs of New York built an entire city more or less from scratch in Italy and, even if we adjust for inflation, was still about 75% of what Killers of the Flower Moon was budgeted for. And most period films do budget for these sorts of things. It's neat that they do this and by all means, if you've got the funds, might as well go hogwild, but it's one of those things where until I actually see what's on the screen, I'm still doubtful of whether or not it needed the sheer amount of money for it because we've seen other period films set in the same era and location still be immersive at a fraction of the cost. I can't really feature Killers having the sort of vast world-building that Gangs did. But I'm willing to be proven wrong.
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Good God
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Post by Good God on Jul 12, 2021 17:00:44 GMT
Even so, Gangs of New York built an entire city more or less from scratch in Italy and, even if we adjust for inflation, was still about 75% of what Killers of the Flower Moon was budgeted for. Different times, different pay grades. Scorsese was coming off flops like Kundun and Bringing Out the Dead at the time, so he was willing to work for less money and was effectively paid $3M for Gangs of New York. I'm pretty sure he's making at least $10M, if not $20M, on this one. Same goes for DiCaprio, who took a paycut to work with Scorsese on that one but is in a position to get $20M + points these days on even projects as risky as this. Also, I'm pretty sure De Niro (who, according to rumors at the time, turned down Gangs of New York because he was put off by how much less he was going to be paid relative to DiCaprio) is getting paid a lot more than Day-Lewis was. I think we've already seen evidence of a commitment to authenticity that is simply impossible for those other period films set in the same era. This is not to say that Killer of the Flower Moon will definitely be more immersive, because that remains to be seen and Scorsese can conceivably still botch it, but they supposedly spent $2M on just the locomotives being authentic for the opening scene. I'm pretty sure no other recent movie set in that era had that luxury.
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Post by stephen on Jul 12, 2021 17:06:53 GMT
Even so, Gangs of New York built an entire city more or less from scratch in Italy and, even if we adjust for inflation, was still about 75% of what Killers of the Flower Moon was budgeted for. Different times, different pay grades. Scorsese was coming off flops like Kundun and Bringing Out the Dead at the time, so he was willing to work for less money and was effectively paid $3M for Gangs of New York. I'm pretty sure he's making at least $10M, if not $20M, on this one. Same goes for DiCaprio, who took a paycut to work with Scorsese on that one but is in a position to get $20M + points these days on even projects as risky as this. Also, I'm pretty sure De Niro (who, according to rumors at the time, turned down Gangs of New York because he was put off by how much less he was going to be paid relative to DiCaprio) is getting paid a lot more than Day-Lewis was. I think we've already seen evidence of a commitment to authenticity that is simply impossible for those other period films set in the same era. This is not to say that Killer of the Flower Moon will definitely be more immersive, because that remains to be seen and Scorsese can conceivably still botch it, but they supposedly spent $2M on just the locomotives being authentic for the opening scene. I'm pretty sure no other recent movie set in that era had that luxury. I don't doubt the level of commitment for the authenticity, and bringing aboard the likes of Jack Fisk (who is the best production designer in the biz and who has made his bones doing things like this before for films like There Will Be Blood, The New World and The Revenant) and the stories of the costumes being hand-stitched by local tribespeople do give me a lot of hope. I'm not doubting Scorsese's commitment; it's just that any exorbitant amount will always give me pause, especially when it's gonna be tough to see all of that money on screen in the final product (as much of it will go to actors' salaries, and you hope the performances will be worth those figures).
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Post by quetee on Jul 12, 2021 17:18:38 GMT
Did Marty's movies only start getting expensive because of Leo?
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Good God
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Post by Good God on Jul 12, 2021 20:55:39 GMT
Did Marty's movies only start getting expensive because of Leo? I think studios feel a lot more comfortable giving Scorsese, among other directors, budgets of $80M-$100M with DiCaprio in the lead. Part of it is the scope of the production (like with Gangs of New York and The Aviator) and part of it is Scorsese getting however much he wants because DiCaprio is going to be in the movie (like with Shutter Island and Killers of the Flower Moon).
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Post by stephen on Jul 12, 2021 21:56:16 GMT
Did Marty's movies only start getting expensive because of Leo? I think studios feel a lot more comfortable giving Scorsese, among other directors, budgets of $80M-$100M with DiCaprio in the lead. Part of it is the scope of the production (like with Gangs of New York and The Aviator) and part of it is Scorsese getting however much he wants because DiCaprio is going to be in the movie (like with Shutter Island and Killers of the Flower Moon). Never forget that people thought that The Revenant was going to be a flop due to its ballooning budget and had their knives out in force for it. If anything, DiCaprio making that film as bankable as it was is proof positive that the man is damn near invincible as a box-office draw. You can't blame everyone for wanting to work with him, because he pretty much prints money.
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Post by The_Cake_of_Roth on Jul 15, 2021 21:33:02 GMT
Marty in a cowboy hat in one of the pics.
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Post by quetee on Jul 15, 2021 22:08:40 GMT
Isn't Bobby D the one who told Marty he should work with Leo?
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Post by franklin on Jul 15, 2021 23:39:35 GMT
Isn't Bobby D the one who told Marty he should work with Leo? Yes, after working with him in This Boy's Life. Scorsese said he was shocked to hear that because DeNiro never recommended him anyone, nor ever had this type of praise toward a fellow actor.
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futuretrunks
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Post by futuretrunks on Jul 15, 2021 23:53:24 GMT
Yeah, De Niro said that. Marty was impressed with This Boy's Life and Gilbert Grape. Leo ran into Marty at a party in NYC (probably around 1995-1996 IIRC) and Marty said he liked his work and Leo was blown away that Scorsese even knew who he was. They circled each other after that. Leo visited the set of Bringing Out the Dead, and when Gangs of New York got the green light, boom!
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wonky
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Post by wonky on Jul 17, 2021 14:08:02 GMT
Did Marty's movies only start getting expensive because of Leo? I think studios feel a lot more comfortable giving Scorsese, among other directors, budgets of $80M-$100M with DiCaprio in the lead. Part of it is the scope of the production (like with Gangs of New York and The Aviator) and part of it is Scorsese getting however much he wants because DiCaprio is going to be in the movie (like with Shutter Island and Killers of the Flower Moon). Then again, aren't Hugo and The Irishman his two most expensive movies besides this? I think Scorsese did just hit a point where he can get what he wants. Once somebody enters their 60s-70s they're kind of either abandoned by the industry, abandon it themselves, or there's a new swell of respect. The Departed in particular felt like a perfect storm where everything came together and it became clear how much goodwill there was for Scorsese in town, he still had relevance, the audience showed up, and Leo himself growing in esteem. And then Wolf felt like another "level up" for them but I think it's a few factors. He can negotiate, I seem to remember reading he's actually given up final cut contractually a couple times for his budgets, probably a savvy move because it's a bad look at this point for studios to question his judgment anyway and he can probably argue his way through just about anything. The fact that he finally got Silence made at all and for $50m is a testament to what Marty can get away with, whether or not he has Leo.
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Post by jakesully on Jul 17, 2021 14:46:29 GMT
Did Marty's movies only start getting expensive because of Leo? Oh most definitely.
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Post by stephen on Jul 17, 2021 14:50:21 GMT
I think studios feel a lot more comfortable giving Scorsese, among other directors, budgets of $80M-$100M with DiCaprio in the lead. Part of it is the scope of the production (like with Gangs of New York and The Aviator) and part of it is Scorsese getting however much he wants because DiCaprio is going to be in the movie (like with Shutter Island and Killers of the Flower Moon). Then again, aren't Hugo and The Irishman his two most expensive movies besides this? I think Scorsese did just hit a point where he can get what he wants. Once somebody enters their 60s-70s they're kind of either abandoned by the industry, abandon it themselves, or there's a new swell of respect. The Departed in particular felt like a perfect storm where everything came together and it became clear how much goodwill there was for Scorsese in town, he still had relevance, the audience showed up, and Leo himself growing in esteem. And then Wolf felt like another "level up" for them but I think it's a few factors. He can negotiate, I seem to remember reading he's actually given up final cut contractually a couple times for his budgets, probably a savvy move because it's a bad look at this point for studios to question his judgment anyway and he can probably argue his way through just about anything. The fact that he finally got Silence made at all and for $50m is a testament to what Marty can get away with, whether or not he has Leo. Scorsese's definitely gotten to that point, but his last two movies have also been the result of the perfect storm of streamers trying desperately to cement themselves as legitimate studios by scooping up master auteurs by throwing exorbitant budgets at him. If he makes The Irishman or Killers of the Flower Moon with any other studios, they probably don't have the price tag that Netflix and Apple TV+ carry. The latter is likelier because of the DiCaprio factor.
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wonky
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Post by wonky on Jul 17, 2021 15:03:47 GMT
Right that too, he's got the clout and the adaptability to really take advantage of that. So another factor there, but yeah, there's no discounting what a prize DiCaprio has been for him in this part of his career.
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Lubezki
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Post by Lubezki on Aug 3, 2021 15:33:14 GMT
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Post by JangoB on Aug 3, 2021 15:36:53 GMT
Holy shit The GOAT is truly making a comeback.
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Post by wallsofjericho on Aug 3, 2021 15:40:46 GMT
That's pretty awesome!
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Post by Joaquim on Aug 3, 2021 15:43:06 GMT
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Post by stephen on Aug 3, 2021 15:48:10 GMT
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Post by jakesully on Aug 3, 2021 18:37:00 GMT
Fuck yeah! Brendan Fraser in a Scorsese film?! Never thought I'd see the day. So proud of him
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Lubezki
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Post by Lubezki on Aug 10, 2021 17:31:35 GMT
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Post by stephen on Aug 10, 2021 17:35:07 GMT
Whoa damn.
I actually would've loved to see have seen Lithgow in the Old Man Hale role. There's a deep and sour menace that Lithgow is capable of that can be absolutely startling.
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Post by DanQuixote on Aug 10, 2021 17:52:11 GMT
Manifesting an Alan Alda in The Aviator style nom for Lithgow!
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Post by wallsofjericho on Aug 10, 2021 19:26:09 GMT
Yes! Love Lithgow.
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