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Post by pupdurcs on Nov 25, 2020 13:19:40 GMT
.....and homegirl Nicole Kidman in at no.5. Not bad, not bad at all. The 2nd highest placed actress after Isabelle Hupert at no. 2. And the highest placed English speaking actress, as she should be. Glad Tilda Swinton also made it at no.13. I'm sure the inclusion and high placement of Keanu Reeves will generate some controversy (they knew what they were doing.lol!), but it really goes to show how much goodwill and respect he's generated as a film actor and movie star this century, after being a punchline for so much of his early career. He may be far too high, but this is a classic critics move of helping elevate the rep of an actor who never got enough plaudits or respect. You should be proud of yer boy stephen . He's come a long way. Reeves aside, it's a mostly uncontroversial list. Filled with highly respected actors and undervalued but gifted character actors like Wes Studi and Rob Morgan. Not all of them would get on there for me (feels a bit too early to put Michael B Jordan in there, and I wouldn't neccesarily have Oscar Isaac, but I can also see decent arguments for their inclusion). The top two male actors really couldn't be anyone else. Denzel Washington (no.1) and Daniel Day-Lewis (no.3). The top dogs of their generation, and perhaps any generation. The top 25: 25 Gael Garcia Bernal 24 Sonia Braga 23 Mahershala Ali 22 Melissa McCarthy 21 Catherine Denueve 20 Rob Morgan 19 Wes Studi 18 Willem Dafoe 17 Alfre Woodard 16 Kim Min-hee 15 Michael B Jordan 14 Oscar Isaac 13 Tilda Swinton 12 Joaquin Phoenix 11 Julianne Moore 10 Sairose Ronan 9 Viola Davis 8 Zhao Tao 7 Toni Servillo 6 Song Kang-Ho 5 Nicole Kidman 4 Keanu Reeves 3 Daniel Day-Lewis 2 Isabelle Huppert 1 Denzel Washington
www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/movies/greatest-actors-actresses.html
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Post by TerryMontana on Nov 25, 2020 13:33:58 GMT
Uuhhh... ok. Why Reeves is #4? Actually, scratch that. Why is Reeves in the list??
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Post by pupdurcs on Nov 25, 2020 13:40:48 GMT
Uuhhh... ok. Why Reeves is #4? Actually, scratch that. Why is Reeves in the list?? Critics trying to elevate the respect level of an actor they feel is too underrated. Not the first time it happpens and won't be the last. They want to get people talking about us valuing Reeves. To be fair, he is an incredible movie star, and has improved tremendously over the years. If he is in something and it sounds good, I'll give it a watch. Can't say that for all movie stars. I've sat through three John Wick movies for this guy The rest of the list is pretty standard/ solid though, with some interesting non-English speaking actors that people will hopefully be encouraged to check out.
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Post by franklin on Nov 25, 2020 13:43:39 GMT
WTF???? Rob Morgan and Mahershala Ali are here, but not DiCaprio, Bale, Hardy, and Gyllenhaal???
This list is a huge joke.
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Post by stephen on Nov 25, 2020 14:04:51 GMT
KEANU FOREVER.
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Post by thomasjerome on Nov 25, 2020 14:09:10 GMT
I was thinking it's a joke that Michael B. Jordan is ahead of Woodard, Dafoe and Braga. Then I saw Keanu Reeves.
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Post by pacinoyes on Nov 25, 2020 14:09:21 GMT
This list is pretty awful - are more than 1/2 of the "greatest" actors of the 21st century PoC? So "woke"! But lists are made to make fun of so with that in mind........ Observations:Keanu Reeves at 4 is classic wtf-ery, and I love the whole idea of him but nah. Denzel at 1 is um........well not "#1" to me.......but really without Hanks, DiCaprio, Bale, Bridges, Oldman at all that looks more absurd than it would if he beat his genuine rivals. DiCaprio missing is as preposterous as Reeves making it - especially since compared to the guy at number 1 - he has nearly twice as many Oscar nods in the era (for example), bigger and far better films etc than him - that's not anti-'Zel bias, those are facts........but especially with Michael B. Jordan (use your head!) and Rob Morgan on the list at all I have never seen "Toni Servillo" spelled "Tony" before tbh..... Oscar Isaac is 14 but no Driver or Gosling ......no one is buying that. And very best of all:Melissa McCarthy has had a better century than Streep, Blanchett, Haenel for starters
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Post by JangoB on Nov 25, 2020 14:16:17 GMT
Congrats!
The list is the most obvious film twitter pandering I think I've ever seen but it's a deserved #1 spot.
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morton
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Post by morton on Nov 25, 2020 14:25:58 GMT
.....and homegirl Nicole Kidman in at no.5. Not bad, not bad at all. The 2nd highest placed actress after Isabelle Hupert at no. 2. And the highest placed English speaking actress, as she should be. Glad Tilda Swinton also made it at no.13. I'm sure the inclusion and high placement of Keanu Reeves will generate some controversy (they knew what they were doing.lol!), but it really goes to show how much goodwill and respect he's generated as a film actor and movie star this century, after being a punchline for so much of his early career. He may be far too high, but this is a classic critics move of helping elevate the rep of an actor who never got enough plaudits or respect. You should be proud of yer boy stephen . He's come a long way. Reeves aside, it's a mostly uncontroversial list. Filled with highly respected actors and undervalued but gifted character actors like Wes Studi and Rob Morgan. Not all of them would get on there for me (feels a bit too early to put Michael B Jordan in there, and I wouldn't neccesarily have Oscar Isaac, but I can also see decent arguments for their inclusion). The top two male actors really couldn't be anyone else. Denzel Washington (no.1) and Daniel Day-Lewis (no.3). The top dogs of their generation, and perhaps any generation. The top 25: 25 Gael Garcia Bernal 24 Sonia Braga 23 Mahershala Ali 22 Melissa McCarthy 21 Catherine Denueve 20 Rob Morgan 19 Wes Studi 18 Willem Dafoe 17 Alfre Woodard 16 Kim Min-hee 15 Michael B Jordan 14 Oscar Isaac 13 Tilda Swinton 12 Joaquin Phoenix 11 Julianne Moore 10 Sairose Ronan 9 Viola Davis 8 Zhao Tao 7 Toni Servillo 6 Song Kang-Ho 5 Nicole Kidman 4 Keanu Reeves 3 Daniel Day-Lewis 2 Isabelle Huppert 1 Denzel Washington
www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/movies/greatest-actors-actresses.html
The list isn't too bad, imo, and for the most part I like their left field choices. For instance, I don't have a problem with Keanu Reeves being on the list; although, I don't know if I would put him so high even with him still having such a high degree of success despite all the ups and downs his career has had before, and the John Wick movies being such a huge part of pop culture. I agree about Oscar Isaac though being on here especially that high above someone like Willem Dafoe. After Inside Llewyn Davis, I thought for sure he was going to be huge, and he'd win an Oscar within 10 years and at least be nominated for one in 5 years, and while I think he's doing alright for himself, I don't know that he's lived up to that initial promise. I mean his performance in ILD is fantastic, and if it were just about greatest performances this century, he would definitely deserve to be on the list, but I don't know that I'd include him over the likes of people Franklin mentioned. Or even Tom Hanks, Adam Driver, Brian Tyree Henry, Matthew McConaughey, or even Sam Rockwell who I feel has become a little one-note lately at least in terms of what roles he's been taking, seem like they've been more consistent and put out more great performances this decade. Two really great performances doesn't equal the consistency or output that those other names have had this decade imo. I don't have a problem with MBJ being on the list because he I think he's made more of a lasting impression than Isaac and has been more consistent, at least so far, but maybe a little high. I would maybe switch him and Ali.
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Post by stephen on Nov 25, 2020 14:28:18 GMT
I've sat through three John Wick movies for this guy I mean, let's be real, though -- the John Wick films are awesome even aside from Reeves. He's just the linchpin that brings that fantastic, incredible world together. I also hold out hope that the final film in the franchise will have Reeves squaring off against a bonafide A-list star on the level of Denzel Washington or Tom Cruise. Someone whose bread and butter is the action genre, but who commands enough gravitas and magnetism to justify it. They've had fine actors in the bad guy role so far (Nyqvist is painfully close to a personal nomination from me; that guy took a stock villain role and made me wish he had a spinoff), but this all feels like it's leading to someone truly enormous coming down the pike.
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morton
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Post by morton on Nov 25, 2020 14:29:32 GMT
This list is pretty awful - are more than 1/2 of the "greatest" actors of the 21st century PoC? So "woke"! But lists are made to make fun of so with that in mind........ Observations:Keanu Reeves at 4 is classic wtf-ery, and I love the whole idea of him but nah. Denzel at 1 is um........well not "#1" to me.......but really without Hanks, DiCaprio, Bale, Bridges, Oldman at all that looks more absurd than it would if he beat his genuine rivals. DiCaprio missing is as preposterous as Reeves making it - especially since compared to the guy at number 1 - he has nearly twice as many Oscar nods in the era (for example), bigger and far better films etc than him - that's not anti-'Zel bias, those are facts........but especially with Michael B. Jordan (use your head!) and Rob Morgan on the list at all I have never seen "Toni Servillo" spelled "Tony" before tbh..... Oscar Isaac is 14 but no Driver or Gosling ......no one is buying that. And very best of all:Melissa McCarthy has had a better century than Streep, Blanchett, Haenel for starters
Crap I forgot to mention Gosling, but yeah he should definitely be on the list before someone like Oscar Isaac, and I love Isaac. Also I love McCarthy, and think it's unfortunate that she works with her husband so often and in other material that's beneath her, but I do have to give her credit because she always elevates that shitty material (although sometimes not near enough), and she has so much star power imo. I don't know I would put her above those actresses that you mention either, but I can see why she was included and her inclusion doesn't bother me as much as some others.
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Post by Pittsnogle_Goggins on Nov 25, 2020 14:38:05 GMT
Pretty hard to take this list seriously.
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Post by fiosnasiob on Nov 25, 2020 14:51:42 GMT
Top 3 is excellent, WHY they had to include Keanu Reeves just after that ? I like their write up about Zel, I mean, IT IS WHAT IT IS. Leonardo DiCaprio is obviously the one missing among Hollywood male actors. Love the inclusion of Song Kang-Ho, I'm a Choi Min-sik fanboy but during the last 10 years Song probably surpassed him in my heart (or at least in my mind)
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Post by stephen on Nov 25, 2020 14:55:22 GMT
Top 3 is excellent, WHY they had to include Keanu Reeves just after that ? Now I know you're not ripping on Keanu. From 1999 on, that man has been crushing it. It says a lot when most of the criticism of his bad work comes from a movie made in 1992. Hell, I think that one could make the very real argument that from this decade alone, he'd deserve to be in the top five.
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Post by fiosnasiob on Nov 25, 2020 15:04:01 GMT
Top 3 is excellent, WHY they had to include Keanu Reeves just after that ? Now I know you're not ripping on Keanu. From 1999 on, that man has been crushing it. It says a lot when most of the criticism of his bad work comes from a movie made in 1992. Hell, I think that one could make the very real argument that from this decade alone, he'd deserve to be in the top five. Yeah I don't see it, I like him well enough as an action star (in the mold he was put in) but not enough for such praises. However we may agree on the fact that Matthew McConaughey could have make it and it would not have been undeserved.
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Post by ibbi on Nov 25, 2020 15:07:57 GMT
Honestly, the only explanation for most of this list is they must have gotten some complaints about diversity or something. Seriously... Wes Studi? 21st century? They don't even have anything real to say. He was WASTED in Hostiles.
Still, regardless of what you make of the choices (nobody is ever going to agree on that, and at least this isn't just all the usual suspects) most of it really is a very interesting read with some occasional great really insightful or illuminating bits. Also, love, love, love the inclusion of Rob Morgan.
Actually until the top 5 the only parts I didn't find particularly interesting (aside from the aforementioned Studi bit) were Denzel and Bong's writeups for Viola and Song (One of which is just thoroughly uninteresting, and the other of which is just the most banal list of basic observations anyone that's watched his movies could tell you) and the bit on Servillo.
Then you get to the top 5, and when it should get better I think it gets worse. I love the Huppert stuff, but the other 4? Like between Kidman, Keanu, Day-Lewis and Denzel the only bit that I found even well written was the part on Denzel's intro in Fences. They're all just about what great kinds of stars they are, and how a couple of them so often rise above crap material. The Denzel one is just filled with the kinds of superficial superlatives I like these two so much primarily because they always go out of their way to avoid them.
The Reeves one HAS to be a troll job to get attention because it is both the least convincing thing on the list, and just flat out inaccurate. He IS a great star, and he has a few damn fine performances to his name, but he only really, truly became a figure of fun IN the 21st century with the Matrix sequels that they totally gloss over. John Wick has absolutely rehabbed his image (and what they say about him in there as opposed to someone like Gerry Butler is not wrong) but it ain't much.
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Post by mattfincher on Nov 25, 2020 15:15:09 GMT
Okay, I love Keanu, but given he is the only one on the list, there is no credible argument to be made that he did the best work of the last 20 years of any white male A-lister/movie star (calling Phoenix one, Joker aside, feels wrong).
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Post by TerryMontana on Nov 25, 2020 15:22:03 GMT
Uuhhh... ok. Why Reeves is #4? Actually, scratch that. Why is Reeves in the list?? Critics trying to elevate the respect level of an actor they feel is too underrated. Not the first time it happpens and won't be the last. They want to get people talking about us valuing Reeves. To be fair, he is an incredible movie star, and has improved tremendously over the years. If he is in something and it sounds good, I'll give it a watch. Can't say that for all movie stars. I've sat through three John Wick movies for this guy The rest of the list is pretty standard/ solid though, with some interesting non-English speaking actors that people will hopefully be encouraged to check out. Not convinced, sorry. Not your fault of course.
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Post by pupdurcs on Nov 25, 2020 15:22:57 GMT
Honestly, the only explanation for most of this list is they must have gotten some complaints about diversity or something. Seriously... Wes Studi? 21st century? They don't even have anything real to say. He was WASTED in Hostiles. Well, Studi won an honorary Oscar last year, and is insanely prolific (even this century). It's possible that in their function as film critics, they've had the opportunity to see him do a lot of superlative work in obscure movies that were never on our radar. And I do know from the work I have seen him in, that he is an exceptional actor.
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Post by mattfincher on Nov 25, 2020 15:24:22 GMT
Keanu is interesting to talk about on a metatextual level and is very affable. But frankly, so are many movie stars. And this list excluded almost all of them. He has limited range, but I think as a movie star, is very good and interesting as a cultural artifact. He has also suffered the common problem of being called underrated for so long that he has inevitably become overrated.
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Post by pacinoyes on Nov 25, 2020 15:25:49 GMT
Top 3 is excellent, WHY they had to include Keanu Reeves just after that ? Hell, I think that one could make the very real argument that from this decade alone, he'd deserve to be in the top five.This is pacinoyes hot take wtf-ish worthy.......ballsy statement ^.........I'm thankful for this sort of thing on Thanksgiving ........
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Post by mattfincher on Nov 25, 2020 15:27:34 GMT
I will never understand some of the actors Stephen is mercilessly critical of and the others he full heartedly supports, but I admire his conviction.
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Post by ibbi on Nov 25, 2020 15:32:41 GMT
Honestly, the only explanation for most of this list is they must have gotten some complaints about diversity or something. Seriously... Wes Studi? 21st century? They don't even have anything real to say. He was WASTED in Hostiles. Well, Studi won an honorary Oscar last year, and is insanely prolific (even this century). It's possible that in their function as film critics, they've had the opportunity to see him do a lot of superlative work in obscure movies that were never on our radar. And I do know from the work I have seen him in, that he is an exceptional actor. Don't get me wrong, I LOVE that guy. But if they have indeed seen him do superlative work in the last 20 years then they should talk about it rather than a movie in which his underuse was criminal.
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sirchuck23
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Bad news dawg...you don't mind if I have some of your 300 dollar a glass shit there would ya?
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Post by sirchuck23 on Nov 25, 2020 16:08:40 GMT
.....and homegirl Nicole Kidman in at no.5. Not bad, not bad at all. The 2nd highest placed actress after Isabelle Hupert at no. 2. And the highest placed English speaking actress, as she should be. Glad Tilda Swinton also made it at no.13. I'm sure the inclusion and high placement of Keanu Reeves will generate some controversy (they knew what they were doing.lol!), but it really goes to show how much goodwill and respect he's generated as a film actor and movie star this century, after being a punchline for so much of his early career. He may be far too high, but this is a classic critics move of helping elevate the rep of an actor who never got enough plaudits or respect. You should be proud of yer boy stephen . He's come a long way. Reeves aside, it's a mostly uncontroversial list. Filled with highly respected actors and undervalued but gifted character actors like Wes Studi and Rob Morgan. Not all of them would get on there for me (feels a bit too early to put Michael B Jordan in there, and I wouldn't neccesarily have Oscar Isaac, but I can also see decent arguments for their inclusion). The top two male actors really couldn't be anyone else. Denzel Washington (no.1) and Daniel Day-Lewis (no.3). The top dogs of their generation, and perhaps any generation. The top 25: 25 Gael Garcia Bernal 24 Sonia Braga 23 Mahershala Ali 22 Melissa McCarthy 21 Catherine Denueve 20 Rob Morgan 19 Wes Studi 18 Willem Dafoe 17 Alfre Woodard 16 Kim Min-hee 15 Michael B Jordan 14 Oscar Isaac 13 Tilda Swinton 12 Joaquin Phoenix 11 Julianne Moore 10 Sairose Ronan 9 Viola Davis 8 Zhao Tao 7 Toni Servillo 6 Song Kang-Ho 5 Nicole Kidman 4 Keanu Reeves 3 Daniel Day-Lewis 2 Isabelle Huppert 1 Denzel Washington
www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/movies/greatest-actors-actresses.html
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Post by pupdurcs on Nov 25, 2020 16:23:02 GMT
.....and homegirl Nicole Kidman in at no.5. Not bad, not bad at all. The 2nd highest placed actress after Isabelle Hupert at no. 2. And the highest placed English speaking actress, as she should be. Glad Tilda Swinton also made it at no.13. I'm sure the inclusion and high placement of Keanu Reeves will generate some controversy (they knew what they were doing.lol!), but it really goes to show how much goodwill and respect he's generated as a film actor and movie star this century, after being a punchline for so much of his early career. He may be far too high, but this is a classic critics move of helping elevate the rep of an actor who never got enough plaudits or respect. You should be proud of yer boy stephen . He's come a long way. Reeves aside, it's a mostly uncontroversial list. Filled with highly respected actors and undervalued but gifted character actors like Wes Studi and Rob Morgan. Not all of them would get on there for me (feels a bit too early to put Michael B Jordan in there, and I wouldn't neccesarily have Oscar Isaac, but I can also see decent arguments for their inclusion). The top two male actors really couldn't be anyone else. Denzel Washington (no.1) and Daniel Day-Lewis (no.3). The top dogs of their generation, and perhaps any generation. The top 25: 25 Gael Garcia Bernal 24 Sonia Braga 23 Mahershala Ali 22 Melissa McCarthy 21 Catherine Denueve 20 Rob Morgan 19 Wes Studi 18 Willem Dafoe 17 Alfre Woodard 16 Kim Min-hee 15 Michael B Jordan 14 Oscar Isaac 13 Tilda Swinton 12 Joaquin Phoenix 11 Julianne Moore 10 Sairose Ronan 9 Viola Davis 8 Zhao Tao 7 Toni Servillo 6 Song Kang-Ho 5 Nicole Kidman 4 Keanu Reeves 3 Daniel Day-Lewis 2 Isabelle Huppert 1 Denzel Washington
www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/movies/greatest-actors-actresses.html
I didn't realise a GOAT could clap so well
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