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Post by pacinoyes on Oct 3, 2020 11:23:33 GMT
Thought this would be a good matchup since in several ways these guys evoke each other .........underrated to very many people (although I'd say Duvall - as much as I respect him - has been over-Oscar nominated to me)......both with 7 Oscar nominations which are all-time numbers ...........and 1 Oscar win for each in a role that's obviously very similar. They are fans of each other too ....... Duvall did stage work early on before stopping and he did TV - TV to great acclaim - he's an Emmy winner too and I've called him a US GOAT contender for all 3 mediums Stage/TV/Film..........Bridges makes a big TV series move very soon in "Old Man" opposite John Lithgow. I'd rank these guys quite closely in that "#11-20" batch of the Great American film actors imo - which is a very competitive group to me ( Hanks, Duvall, DiCaprio, Washington, Scott, Stewart, Bridges, Clift...........just to name a few there......). Surprised we've never done them in poll as far as I can tell ..........Who do you prefer here of these 2 quintessentially American actors?
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Post by TerryMontana on Oct 3, 2020 13:40:50 GMT
I say Bridges but it's a tough one.
Duvall is versatile, he can be dramatic, funny and intimidating all at the same time. Plus his earlier filmography was very consistent.
On the other hand, Bridges is more talented and with a much richer filmography. In fact, there are always at least 2-3 movies of his in every decade that almost anybody has seen/can remember.
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Post by pacinoyes on Oct 3, 2020 16:10:05 GMT
Duvall is versatile, he can be dramatic, funny and intimidating all at the same time. Plus his earlier filmography was very consistent.He's probably the guy - among that group of "great actors without a a successful/big comedy" who's been the funniest within dramas but without having a real successful comedy film all his own.........MASH would be one for him but it's not his film........and in real life he can be hilarious and has a reputation for being a riotous practical joker on set too. Like you could imagine him in several comedies .....but it never happened......really odd.......
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Post by stephen on Oct 3, 2020 16:18:58 GMT
Both are criminally under-discussed in respects to their place in the pantheon of their respective generations. Duvall, for me, is topped only by Hackman when it comes to pure talent of the '70s gents (and I think he's better than the Big Four, some of whom by quite a distance). Bridges, as we've discussed before, is harder to really box into a particular generation because he's technically a peer of De Niro/Pacino but we don't think of him that way because he grew up in the business, so his longevity is deceptive, but we've watched him evolve from child actor to hunky leading man to elder statesman, and he's succeeded in each iteration remarkably well (and I personally think his modern career showcases his best work, too).
I think Bridges has slightly higher individual peaks with The Big Lebowski and Hell or High Water, but Duvall is far more consistent and has several more classics in his canon. But I think both are wonderful and always show up to play ball, regardless of the quality of the material.
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Post by JangoB on Oct 3, 2020 16:52:51 GMT
Both are highly dependable and almost always deliver the goods but I simply find Bridges more interesting and fun.
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Post by TerryMontana on Oct 3, 2020 17:02:59 GMT
Duvall is versatile, he can be dramatic, funny and intimidating all at the same time. Plus his earlier filmography was very consistent.He's probably the guy - among that group of "great actors without a a successful/big comedy" who's been the funniest within dramas but without having a real successful comedy film all his own.........MASH would be one for him but it's not his film........and in real life he can be hilarious and has a reputation for being a riotous practical joker on set too. Like you could imagine him in several comedies .....but it never happened......really odd....... Yet he gave many laughs in MASH. And of course one of his funniest "serious" roles was in Apocalypse Now. Speaking about it, I really need to point out his performance in Get Low. A (kind of) black comedy where he plays with the comic genius that is Bill Murray!!! Too bad Duvall has only made stupid comedies like 4 Christmases and such...
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Post by wallsofjericho on Oct 4, 2020 9:58:01 GMT
Thought this would be a good matchup since in several ways these guys evoke each other .........underrated to very many people (although I'd say Duvall - as much as I respect him - has been over-Oscar nominated to me)......both with 7 Oscar nominations which are all-time numbers ...........and 1 Oscar win for each in a role that's obviously very similar. They are fans of each other too ....... Duvall did stage work early on before stopping and he did TV - TV to great acclaim - he's an Emmy winner too and I've called him a US GOAT contender for all 3 mediums Stage/TV/Film..........Bridges makes a big TV series move very soon in "Old Man" opposite John Lithgow. I'd rank these guys quite closely in that "#11-20" batch of the Great American film actors imo - which is a very competitive group to me ( Hanks, Duvall, DiCaprio, Washington, Scott, Stewart, Bridges, Clift...........just to name a few there......). Surprised we've never done them in poll as far as I can tell ..........Who do you prefer here of these 2 quintessentially American actors? I always feel Bridges had more similarities with Hackman. Both have a similar acting style in some ways (relaxed effortless performers) but both are able to seamlessly transition from different genres and can do comedy and drama with ease. this is a good comparison though and I may slightly prefer Bridges but Duvall is one of my favourites too.
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Post by pupdurcs on Oct 4, 2020 10:33:42 GMT
Thought this would be a good matchup since in several ways these guys evoke each other .........underrated to very many people (although I'd say Duvall - as much as I respect him - has been over-Oscar nominated to me)......both with 7 Oscar nominations which are all-time numbers ...........and 1 Oscar win for each in a role that's obviously very similar. They are fans of each other too ....... Duvall did stage work early on before stopping and he did TV - TV to great acclaim - he's an Emmy winner too and I've called him a US GOAT contender for all 3 mediums Stage/TV/Film..........Bridges makes a big TV series move very soon in "Old Man" opposite John Lithgow. I'd rank these guys quite closely in that "#11-20" batch of the Great American film actors imo - which is a very competitive group to me ( Hanks, Duvall, DiCaprio, Washington, Scott, Stewart, Bridges, Clift...........just to name a few there......). Surprised we've never done them in poll as far as I can tell ..........Who do you prefer here of these 2 quintessentially American actors? I always feel Bridges had more similarities with Hackman. Both have a similar acting style in some ways (relaxed effortless performers) but both are able to seamlessly transition from different genres and can do comedy and drama with ease. this is a good comparison though and I may slightly prefer Bridges but Duvall is one of my favourites too. Bridges had significantly more career advantages than Hackman or Duvall. Those guys were character actors, who could carry a movie (especially Hackman, whose career was something of a miracle. I do think Duvall suffers almost from being seen as the stodgier, less fun version of Hackman). Bridges was a conventional leading man. He could play the handsome hero who got the girl, the type of parts rarely given to someone like Duvall. When you look like Duvall (a stern looking guy, who was already balding when he made his screen breakthrough) you won't get to play many of the kind of roles Bridges was allowed to. Duvall would never be cast in The Fabulous Baker Boys or Starman or Against All Odds. So the range of roles accessible for Duvall to play over his career was always much narrower than Bridges....which is more a function of looks and physicality, as opposed to ability.
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Post by pupdurcs on Oct 4, 2020 10:43:17 GMT
On the other hand, Bridges is more talented and with a much richer filmography. In fact, there are always at least 2-3 movies of his in every decade that almost anybody has seen/can remember. Is it really a fair comparison though, considering Bridges has been a leading man his whole career, while Duvall was a character actor who sometimes got to carry a film. They were never on the same playing field in terms of opportunities.
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Post by jimmalone on Oct 4, 2020 11:26:07 GMT
Clearly Duvall. An all-time great.
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Post by pacinoyes on Oct 4, 2020 11:33:24 GMT
wallsofjericho - Good point and I'd agree in some ways Hackman is more like Bridges but I try to avoid Hackman in polls now personally tbh - he recently beat Nicholson in one of my polls .....so I just kind of know he's not losing to anyone unless it's the guys at the very top of the list - maybe (?) (DePac, Brando, DDL): See below btw: Mean Gene was 6th on our GOAT poll (1 spot behind Nicholson!)..... Bridges was 26th (too low?)..... Duvall was tied for 35th.......so Bridges/Duvall sort of won by default for the matchup here with being closer and having some similarities. Would be curious what people think of those 3 guys poll placements tbh...... 01 Al Pacino 02 Marlon Brando 03 Daniel Day-Lewis 04 Robert De Niro 05 Jack Nicholson 06 Gene Hackman 07 Dustin Hoffman 08 James Stewart 09 Paul Newman 10 Jack Lemmon 11 Philip Seymour Hoffman 12 Joaquin Phoenix 13 Denzel Washington 14 Peter O’Toole 15 Toshiro Mifune 16 Montgomery Clift 17 Charles Chaplin 18 Laurence Olivier 19 Richard Burton 20 George C. Scott XX Tom Hanks 22 Max von Sydow 23 Robin Williams 24 Gerard Depardieu 25 Humphrey Bogart 26 Jeff Bridges 27 Leonardo DiCaprio 28 Anthony Hopkins 29 Cary Grant XX Gary Oldman 31 Spencer Tracy 32 Henry Fonda 33 Ralph Fiennes 34 Burt Lancaster 35 James Cagney XX Robert Duvall 37 Peter Sellers 38 Ryan Gosling 39 Donald Sutherland 40 Alec Guinness 41 Nicolas Cage 42 Willem Dafoe 43 Marcello Mastroianni 44 Daniel Auteuil XX Morgan Freeman 46 Albert Finney 47 Javier Bardem 48 Edward Norton XX James Mason XX Michael Cain
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Post by TerryMontana on Oct 4, 2020 13:25:22 GMT
On the other hand, Bridges is more talented and with a much richer filmography. In fact, there are always at least 2-3 movies of his in every decade that almost anybody has seen/can remember. Is it really a fair comparison though, considering Bridges has been a leading man his whole career, while Duvall was a character actor who sometimes got to carry a film. They were never on the same playing field in terms of opportunities. Well, your favorite movie quote ( ) says "It's what it is"... You have a good point here but that's how things are. This poll compares the two of them and in terms of filmography, Bridges wins, even without a Godfather.
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Post by pupdurcs on Oct 4, 2020 13:43:20 GMT
Is it really a fair comparison though, considering Bridges has been a leading man his whole career, while Duvall was a character actor who sometimes got to carry a film. They were never on the same playing field in terms of opportunities. Well, your favorite movie quote ( ) says "It's what it is"... You have a good point here but that's how things are. This poll compares the two of them and in terms of filmography, Bridges wins, even without a Godfather. My point being, that it only seems like an equal comparison, because Duvall has wildly overachieved relative to his actual position in the industry (hence the same amount of Oscar recignition), which is a highly regarded character actor. Bridges was an out and out movie star and leading man. But really, it's like comparing Ed Harris and Tom Hanks or something career wise. Ed Harris is a great actor who has carried some movies, but usually, he's going to be the guy supporting Tom Hanks in a movie. Sure you can make the comparison if you want, but the fact that they are not on a level playing field in terms of opportunity should be acknowledged.
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Post by pacinoyes on Oct 4, 2020 13:51:59 GMT
Is it really a fair comparison though, considering Bridges has been a leading man his whole career, while Duvall was a character actor who sometimes got to carry a film. They were never on the same playing field in terms of opportunities. Well, your favorite movie quote ( ) says "It's what it is"... You have a good point here but that's how things are. This poll compares the two of them and in terms of filmography, Bridges wins, even without a Godfather. That's exactly right. Didn't he JUST do a poll between Cate Blanchett vs. Tilda Swinton which is this same thing anyway (?) - I doubt Swinton had the "opportunities" Blanchett did - but we compared them......Blanchett won.......shrug. The poll is simply "better" ............not "better among people who always had the same exact opportunities".....
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Post by pupdurcs on Oct 4, 2020 13:57:38 GMT
I acknowledged the discrepencies in mainstream opportunity and industry status between Blanchett and Swinton. But at the very least, Swinton's stature as a major auteur muse and arthouse leading lady allowed her to play a range of roles comparable to Blanchett, even if far less people saw them. The conversation around this poll just seemed to operate on the position that Bridges and Duvall were on the same (or roughly equal) playing field career and status wise and access to a similar range of roles, and it's just something I thought needed at least addressing or acknowledgement. Not saying they can't or shouldn't be compared.
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Post by therealcomicman117 on Oct 4, 2020 15:54:46 GMT
I get where pupdurcs is coming from. Duvall and Bridges are not only of a much different generation, but also they're much different in terms of how their careers track. Bridges was a handsome leading man who just also happened to be a challenging and strong actor, Duvall was a character actor, who lucked into leading roles that played off his "world-weary older guy image" ( The Great Santini, Tender Mercies). Bridges breakout role was in The Last Picture Show, and he went on to play the heroic male lead in the 1976 version of King Kong, while Duvall's debut was To Kill A Mockingbird where he played the creepy neighbor next door, and his hair was already receding. In some ways, it's an interesting comparison, but I voted for Bridges, because I find his filmography more overall fascinating and satisfying even if Duvall has been in some of my favorites, and is excellent actor as well.
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Post by TerryMontana on Oct 4, 2020 16:00:25 GMT
But isn't that the thing in almost every comparison in a movie thread?? There are not many actors who have taken the same career opportunities in order to rightly compare them
We just say our opinions as to whom we personally prefer.
Having said that, I really enjoy any kind of duscussion about career opportunities.
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Post by therealcomicman117 on Oct 4, 2020 16:06:06 GMT
But isn't that the thing in almost every comparison in a movie thread?? There are not many actors who have taken the same career opportunities in order to rightly compare them We just say our opinions as to whom we personally prefer. Having said that, I really enjoy any kind of duscussion about career opportunities. Oh of course. I appreciate the discussion and discourse around comparing two well-regarded actors, but also I like pointing out how dissimilar and similar they are at the same time. We might say Duvall's been in more "turkeys" overall, but also in some ways, he hasn't had the same kind of opportunities that Bridges has.
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Post by TerryMontana on Oct 4, 2020 16:37:51 GMT
But isn't that the thing in almost every comparison in a movie thread?? There are not many actors who have taken the same career opportunities in order to rightly compare them We just say our opinions as to whom we personally prefer. Having said that, I really enjoy any kind of duscussion about career opportunities. Oh of course. I appreciate the discussion and discourse around comparing two well-regarded actors, but also I like pointing out how dissimilar and similar they are at the same time. We might say Duvall's been in more "turkeys" overall, but also in some ways, he hasn't had the same kind of opportunities that Bridges has. If we tried to find actors with same opportunities to compare, we'd only come up with the eternal comparison Pacino vs De Niro. And maybe not even that
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Post by pupdurcs on Oct 4, 2020 17:12:11 GMT
Oh of course. I appreciate the discussion and discourse around comparing two well-regarded actors, but also I like pointing out how dissimilar and similar they are at the same time. We might say Duvall's been in more "turkeys" overall, but also in some ways, he hasn't had the same kind of opportunities that Bridges has. If we tried to find actors with same opportunities to compare, we'd only come up with the eternal comparison Pacino vs De Niro. And maybe not even that You are right, that it's rare that any actor is exactly like for like in opportunities and range of parts they can play, but some are quite clearly closer than others. For example, most prestige leading men have a similar range of opportunities or parts available to them, which is why it's not much of a reach to compare say Leonardo DiCaprio and Christian Bale as actors. Leo is a bigger star, but Bale has had access to a similiar range of roles. Like I said, I never said they can't or shouldn't be compared. But for the most part, I think we usually point out things like if one actor is a character actor who mainly gets offered supporting roles and one is a leading man, to give some added context to the discussion. Not sure why this is a controversial position to hold. Seems fairly standard But I'll leave it there...
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Post by pacinoyes on Oct 4, 2020 17:17:02 GMT
Duvall and Bridges are not only of a much different generation Well ......... Keep in mind, that in the GOAT thread which I used as a guide here - we ranked actors of every country, every language and every generation - so that happens a lot on MAR.......in general I agree with you, always compare actors by country and generation first and foremost. As I said however, these 2 have the same amount of Oscar nominations (7), wins (1), a win for Bridges in a movie they were both in (!) and that was similar to the older actors win too (!) ........and have conveyed a respect for each other. Bridges is very hard to find a comparison point to actually - neither 70s nor 80s (to me he "emerges" in the 80s, but that's highly arguable), not anything really like Hanks, Cage, Spacey, Washington, Penn, Dafoe in his own age group either imo.........to me that's part of his charm tbh ........he's quite singular and people who rank him as the "best" of that age 60-70 group probably would likely use that quality as part of that ranking.
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Post by therealcomicman117 on Oct 4, 2020 17:44:41 GMT
Duvall and Bridges are not only of a much different generation Well ......... Keep in mind, that in the GOAT thread which I used as a guide here - we ranked actors of every country, every language and every generation - so that happens a lot on MAR.......in general I agree with you, always compare actors by country and generation first and foremost. As I said however, these 2 have the same amount of Oscar nominations (7), wins (1), a win for Bridges in a movie they were both in (!) and that was similar to the older actors win too (!) ........and have conveyed a respect for each other. Bridges is very hard to find a comparison point to actually - neither 70s nor 80s (to me he "emerges" in the 80s, but that's highly arguable), not anything really like Hanks, Cage, Spacey, Washington, Penn, Dafoe in his own age group either imo.........to me that's part of his charm tbh ........he's quite singular and people who rank him as the "best" of that age 60-70 group probably would likely use that quality as part of that ranking. And that's why I find Bridges career fascinating as well. He's literally born in Hollywood to a semi-known actor of the time (Lloyd Bridges was not some famous actor, but he had clout back then), and he strangely bridges (no pun intended), the gap between the old and new Hollywood in some ways. He co-starred with Clint Eastwood as a young man, but also been paired with actors like Robin Williams, James Woods, Michelle Pfeiffer etc... You can argue as far as his particular generation is concerned, he's almost like an actor out of time.
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Post by TerryMontana on Oct 4, 2020 18:25:15 GMT
If we tried to find actors with same opportunities to compare, we'd only come up with the eternal comparison Pacino vs De Niro. And maybe not even that You are right, that it's rare that any actor is exactly like for like in opportunities and range of parts they can play, but some are quite clearly closer than others. For example, most prestige leading men have a similar range of opportunities or parts available to them, which is why it's not much of a reach to compare say Leonardo DiCaprio and Christian Bale as actors. Leo is a bigger star, but Bale has had access to a similiar range of roles. Like I said, I never said they can't or shouldn't be compared. But for the most part, I think we usually point out things like if one actor is a character actor who mainly gets offered supporting roles and one is a leading man, to give some added context to the discussion. Not sure why this is a controversial position to hold. Seems fairly standard But I'll leave it there... Don't leave it there!! You come up with interesting polls. Leo vs. Bale is another good one. Although I suspect Di Caprio would win it easily...
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Post by pupdurcs on Oct 4, 2020 18:27:35 GMT
You are right, that it's rare that any actor is exactly like for like in opportunities and range of parts they can play, but some are quite clearly closer than others. For example, most prestige leading men have a similar range of opportunities or parts available to them, which is why it's not much of a reach to compare say Leonardo DiCaprio and Christian Bale as actors. Leo is a bigger star, but Bale has had access to a similiar range of roles. Like I said, I never said they can't or shouldn't be compared. But for the most part, I think we usually point out things like if one actor is a character actor who mainly gets offered supporting roles and one is a leading man, to give some added context to the discussion. Not sure why this is a controversial position to hold. Seems fairly standard But I'll leave it there... Don't leave it there!! You come up with interesting polls. Leo vs. Bale is another good one. Although I suspect Di Caprio would win it easily... I'm pretty sure that Bale vs Leo is a poll that's already been done and somewhere in the archives
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Post by TerryMontana on Oct 4, 2020 19:35:37 GMT
Don't leave it there!! You come up with interesting polls. Leo vs. Bale is another good one. Although I suspect Di Caprio would win it easily... I'm pretty sure that Bale vs Leo is a poll that's already been done and somewhere in the archives Who won??
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