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Post by pacinoyes on Jun 29, 2020 0:19:49 GMT
welfare queen was popularized by reagan and was absolutely vital in disparaging women of color for many years. Are you seriously "explaining" the history of "welfare queens" to me? Gee, thanks I'm telling you "Karen" disparages white woman ......and I'm telling you there will be a reverse meme because that's how hatred always goes. Go with God instead
not sure who that is but this is the common reasoning for why things of this nature being disparaging to white people isn't seen as racist, it's hardly exclusive to me or black nationalists. The common reasoning is false - I have provided the definition of racist "Karen" fits it inarguably, how it's seen depends on who is "looking" and their agenda - but the words definition IS the definition. This is not semantics btw it's is the very opposite it IS the definition.people are linked to each other for all sorts of things. none of these dudes thought that race wasn't important to their identity lol Ah, not what I said is it......... I said skin color is not a default to your identity necessarily...... your race, gender, sexuality can be important to your identity sure.............but like I always say you live in America (I assume) - your nation of citizenship and the content of your character trumps (no pun) everything else.......I explained this to you before......many times ........not sure why you're replying to me FS we do not see America the same way - I see it as a flawed great country......you see it as a country that needs to be overthrown .......
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Post by quetee on Jun 29, 2020 0:29:57 GMT
My reaction to calling someone Karen is racist.
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Film Socialism
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Post by Film Socialism on Jun 29, 2020 0:43:39 GMT
welfare queen was popularized by reagan and was absolutely vital in disparaging women of color for many years. Are you seriously "explaining" the history of "welfare queens" to me? Gee, thanks I'm telling you "Karen" disparages white woman ......and I'm telling you there will be a reverse meme because that's how hatred always goes. Go with God instead
not sure who that is but this is the common reasoning for why things of this nature being disparaging to white people isn't seen as racist, it's hardly exclusive to me or black nationalists. The common reasoning is false - I have provided the definition of racist "Karen" fits it inarguably, how it's seen depends on who is "looking" and their agenda - but the words definition IS the definition. This is not semantics btw it's is the very opposite it IS the definition.people are linked to each other for all sorts of things. none of these dudes thought that race wasn't important to their identity lol Ah, not what I said is it......... I said skin color is not a default to your identity necessarily...... your race, gender, sexuality can be important to your identity sure.............but like I always say you live in America (I assume) - your nation of citizenship and the content of your character trumps (no pun) everything else.......I explained this to you before......many times ........not sure why you're replying to me FS we do not see America the same way - I see it as a flawed great country......you see it as a country that needs to be overthrown .......
seeing as how you said it wasn't "codified" then yeah i guess i would have to explain that that's an incorrect view - the "reverse" has already happened to black women. plus there is no bearing on that reversal actually occurring; when have terms which disparaged white people been used to then disparage other races? nobody has started calling black BLM protesters "crackers" or anything. given your thoughts on the dictionary definitions for other things it seems that you aren't opposed to occasionally thinking outside the webster's box when it comes to strict definitions. even if we say that "karen" is a racist term, i think it would be important to clarify if said racism has an abject effect on society. has white people dancing poorly or white people not seasoning chicken led to white people's lives being worse off? even if you do wish to call that racism, you'd have to define where it matters in peoples' actual lives for me to care, same with anything. skin color isn't a default to identity, no, but clearly it is for many people. your nationality may trump your race for you but let's not pretend that it's a universal feeling - i wouldn't say that race always trumps nationality or anything, that's bringing objectivity into identity.
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Post by pacinoyes on Jun 29, 2020 1:05:22 GMT
given your thoughts on the dictionary definitions for other things it seems that you aren't opposed to occasionally thinking outside the webster's box when it comes to strict definitions. even if we say that "karen" is a racist term, i think it would be important to clarify if said racism has an abject effect on society. has white people dancing poorly or white people not seasoning chicken led to white people's lives being worse off? even if you do wish to call that racism, you'd have to define where it matters in peoples' actual lives for me to care, same with anything. Ok, I think we've reached a happy medium actually - So you admit that "Karen" IS a racist term (because it clearly is) by the strict definition of "racist" - ok, that's progress for you FS! - now the damage the term "Karen" does is in coarsening the culture - I agree it isn't THAT major an effect - but that is why I included the clip here and what Ali's viewpoint would be according to his son. The goal is for all races to live in harmony - "Karen" chips away at that - so yes it isn't greater than that but it also isn't a net zero effect to be dismissed either. skin color isn't a default to identity, no, but clearly it is for many people. your nationality may trump your race for you but let's not pretend that it's a universal feeling - i wouldn't say that race always trumps nationality or anything, that's bringing objectivity into identity. Agree...... you can place anything on the hierarchy of identity (that's freewill) my only caveat is to place an unchangeable metric at the top of the hierarchy (ie you can't change your skin color) is limiting and simplistic.......... but I don't disagree with what you said here.
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Film Socialism
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Post by Film Socialism on Jun 29, 2020 1:38:55 GMT
given your thoughts on the dictionary definitions for other things it seems that you aren't opposed to occasionally thinking outside the webster's box when it comes to strict definitions. even if we say that "karen" is a racist term, i think it would be important to clarify if said racism has an abject effect on society. has white people dancing poorly or white people not seasoning chicken led to white people's lives being worse off? even if you do wish to call that racism, you'd have to define where it matters in peoples' actual lives for me to care, same with anything. Ok, I think we've reached a happy medium actually - So you admit that "Karen" IS a racist term (because it clearly is) by the strict definition of "racist" - ok, that's progress for you FS! - now the damage the term "Karen" does is in coarsening the culture - I agree it isn't THAT major an effect - but that is why I included the clip here and what Ali's viewpoint would be according to his son. The goal is for all races to live in harmony - "Karen" chips away at that - so yes it isn't greater than that but it also isn't a net zero effect to be dismissed either. skin color isn't a default to identity, no, but clearly it is for many people. your nationality may trump your race for you but let's not pretend that it's a universal feeling - i wouldn't say that race always trumps nationality or anything, that's bringing objectivity into identity. Agree...... you can place anything on the hierarchy of identity (that's freewill) my only caveat is to place an unchangeable metric at the top of the hierarchy (ie you can't change your skin color) is limiting and simplistic.......... but I don't disagree with what you said here.
i don't really think it's a racist term in america, though there is merit in assuming that it is for the sake of argument. the adverse effect you are speaking of - that of division - is also not necessarily one that i think is adverse. if people are being terrible people and being recorded for it where before they had impunity to do what they wanted (see: everyone who has ever worked retail having horror stories about this), to me, they were the ones that were chipping away at the whole racial harmony deal. i wish ultimately for a peaceful world but there are of course some pretty violent people out there and you need to defend yourself at times, so recording entitle white women being shitty people is an extension of that. there is no net-zero to calling out this behavior, yes - i think it can ultimately be good that they are getting their comeuppance in some regard. is nationality not unchanging as well? many people see their race itself not as changing but as a fluid thing to identify with e.g. what does it mean to be black, or a lesbian, or a vegan, or what-have-you.
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Post by quetee on Jun 29, 2020 1:54:02 GMT
Calling someone a Karen is not racist because not all white women are Karen's. But if you are black, you are black period. Nobody is going around randomly videotaping white women and going... oh there is Karen sitting there minding her own damn business. But someone will randomly ask a black man minding his own business why he is sitting there.
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erickeitel
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Post by erickeitel on Jun 29, 2020 1:58:37 GMT
How the fnck is the whole "Karen" thing not skirting around racism btw .......I mean I've laughed at times at Karen material - there's something funny in all stereotypes (on some level) but it really is vile sh it on some deeper societal level too. Let's mock a personalty type of a specific race and name her......I always mock people for being humorless and I'm clearly not - in fact if anything I'm too jokey when I should be more serious ............but one day people will look back on the use of "Karen" and see that it was pretty fncked up weaponization of it .....I'm not sure it's healthy at all. Faith Salie had a good TV piece on this today actually that went well with my bagel and coffee.......lots and lots of coffee..... It's true that Karen culture can easily devolve into something worse, like sexism and go beyond adequate responses for things like Kidz Bop Karen (who's briefly edited into the video). Comment on her obnoxiousness, sure, but no need to insult her appearance and weight. But do I think, down the line, that this is something we're going to look back on and feel remorseful of? Probably not. The ones that typically get made fun of the most are often the most deserving targets (i.e. Trader Joe's tantrum Karen). Social media trends are a dime a dozen anyway, and this one will probably be replaced by another down the line.
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Post by pacinoyes on Jun 29, 2020 2:10:00 GMT
i don't really think it's a racist term in america, though there is merit in assuming that it is for the sake of argument. Well that and the definition of racist is met by the term "Karen" - like I always say - words matter and that's not semantics it's definition. I get why you say "I don't really think" but its bigger than your POV .......it's a fact. is nationality not unchanging as well? many people see their race itself not as changing but as a fluid thing to identify with e.g. what does it mean to be black, or a lesbian, or a vegan, or what-have-you. Nationality doesn't change but I meant it as where you live can certainly change - to live in America as an adult means on some level you agree with the defining documents and its texts - you CHOOSE to be an American: "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."
How beautiful is that ? - To be black and know that means you too - tens of thousands of white men fought for your freedom.........to be white and know that Black Americans fought with you for a land that is as much theirs as yours ........to be Japanese American and know that years after WW II you are as much a part of the American spirit as any White or Black any straight or gay any male or female........beautiful thing that is........
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Post by The_Cake_of_Roth on Jun 29, 2020 2:18:55 GMT
Sorry to insert myself here, but I think a more useful definition of racism (see below) is cogently presented in Ibram X. Kendi's recent book How to Be an Antiracist, and I think it complements what Film Socialism is getting at here. Also, dictionary definitions can be antiquated, incomplete, and don't always reflect changes in culture: Racism definition: Merriam-Webster to make update after request"Racism is a marriage of racist policies and racist ideas that produces and normalizes racial inequities . . . the defining question is whether discrimination is creating equity or inequity." [emphasis added]
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Post by pacinoyes on Jun 29, 2020 2:22:32 GMT
Calling someone a Karen is not racist because not all white women are Karen's. This is f'n gross racist sh it tbh probably the worst thing I've ever read on here........... so can someone say not all Black people are _________ but maybe some are so it's not a racist term? GTFO You (or I) don't get to define the context of any term - it's racist, period. The words have definitions, period. A black women can't be a Karen at all therefore the term = racist, period. It's like welfare mother or cracker - because it doesn't apply to EVERYONE of the race is not the point at all- that it applies only to ONE race IS the point Racism DEFINED: a person who shows or feels discrimination or prejudice against people of other races, or who believes that a particular race is superior to another.
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Post by quetee on Jun 29, 2020 2:29:11 GMT
Calling someone a Karen is not racist because not all white women are Karen's. This is f'n gross racist sh it tbh probably the worst thing I've ever read on here........... so can someone say not all Black people are _________ but maybe some are so it's not a racist term? GTFO You (or I) don't get to define the context of any term - it's racist, period. The words have definitions, period. A black women can't be a Karen at all therefore the term = racist, period. It's like welfare mother or cracker - because it doesn't apply to EVERYONE of the race is not the point at all- that it applies only to ONE race IS the point Racism DEFINED: a person who shows or feels discrimination or prejudice against people of other races, or who believes that a particular race is superior to another.What is distributing is your low key approach to this whole thing. Nobody is fooled by your bullshit.
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Post by pacinoyes on Jun 29, 2020 2:31:28 GMT
Sorry to insert myself here, but I think a more useful definition of racism (see below) is cogently presented in Ibram X. Kendi's recent book How to Be an Antiracist, and I think it complements what Film Socialism is getting at here. Also, dictionary definitions can be antiquated, incomplete, and don't always reflect changes in culture: Racism definition: Merriam-Webster to make update after request"Racism is a marriage of racist policies and racist ideas that produces and normalizes racial inequities . . . the defining question is whether discrimination is creating equity or inequity." [emphasis added] Well that's changing the meaning of the word isn't it......... I mean that's what all Fascist countries do throughout history change the language - the word here uses the word racism 2 TIMES in the "new" definition itself in the first 8 words - I mean right off the bat you know you're in trouble.........
thefederalist.com/2018/05/01/lefts-war-words-manipulates-mind/
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Film Socialism
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Post by Film Socialism on Jun 29, 2020 2:33:09 GMT
Sorry to insert myself here, but I think a more useful definition of racism (see below) is cogently presented in Ibram X. Kendi's recent book How to Be an Antiracist, and I think it complements what Film Socialism is getting at here. Also, dictionary definitions can be antiquated, incomplete, and don't always reflect changes in culture: Racism definition: Merriam-Webster to make update after request"Racism is a marriage of racist policies and racist ideas that produces and normalizes racial inequities . . . the defining question is whether discrimination is creating equity or inequity." [emphasis added] Well that's changing the meaning of the word isn't it......... I mean that's what all Fascist countries do throughout history change the language - the word here uses the word racism 2 TIMES in the "new" definition itself in the first 8 words - I mean right off the bat you know you're in trouble.........
thefederalist.com/2018/05/01/lefts-war-words-manipulates-mind/my man said we're pivoting to fascism and then cited the federalist lol
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Post by quetee on Jun 29, 2020 2:33:11 GMT
Sorry to insert myself here, but I think a more useful definition of racism (see below) is cogently presented in Ibram X. Kendi's recent book How to Be an Antiracist, and I think it complements what Film Socialism is getting at here. Also, dictionary definitions can be antiquated, incomplete, and don't always reflect changes in culture: Racism definition: Merriam-Webster to make update after request"Racism is a marriage of racist policies and racist ideas that produces and normalizes racial inequities . . . the defining question is whether discrimination is creating equity or inequity." [emphasis added] Well that's changing the meaning of the word isn't it......... I mean that's what all Fascist countries do throughout history change the language - the word here uses the word racism 2 TIMES in the "new" definition itself in the first 8 words - I mean right off the bat you know you're in trouble.........
thefederalist.com/2018/05/01/lefts-war-words-manipulates-mind/
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Post by pacinoyes on Jun 29, 2020 2:37:52 GMT
Well that's changing the meaning of the word isn't it......... I mean that's what all Fascist countries do throughout history change the language - the word here uses the word racism 2 TIMES in the "new" definition itself in the first 8 words - I mean right off the bat you know you're in trouble.........
thefederalist.com/2018/05/01/lefts-war-words-manipulates-mind/my man said we're pivoting to fascism and then cited the federalist lol Well it's sorta like caving to a new definition of "racism" when the 1st definition isn't changing at all and the new wording is the 2nd definition You take your truth where you find it - the importance is the truth, no?
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Post by Pittsnogle_Goggins on Jun 29, 2020 2:46:17 GMT
Imagine equating “Karen” with racism?
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Post by pacinoyes on Jun 29, 2020 2:49:10 GMT
Imagine not equating "Karen" with racism:
Racism DEFINED: a person who shows or feels discrimination or prejudice against people of other races, or who believes that a particular race is superior to another.
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Post by quetee on Jun 29, 2020 2:51:06 GMT
Imagine equating “Karen” with racism? That's what low key people do. Use misdirection to hide their shadiness.
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Post by pacinoyes on Jun 29, 2020 2:53:45 GMT
Imagine equating “Karen” with racism? That's what low key people do. Use misdirection to hide their shadiness. Is that what you did when your racist term didn't apply to "every" member of the white race? Pot. Kettle.......
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Post by quetee on Jun 29, 2020 2:55:52 GMT
That's what low key people do. Use misdirection to hide their shadiness. Is that what you did when your racist term didn't apply to "every" member of the white race? Pot. Kettle....... My racist term? LMAO.
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Post by quetee on Jun 29, 2020 3:04:21 GMT
Imagine not equating "Karen" with racism: Racism DEFINED: a person who shows or feels discrimination or prejudice against people of other races, or who believes that a particular race is superior to another.So where in the original posting does the person calling the man "Karen" feel superior to the actual Karen? The man was blocked from getting into his home and told that the cops were called cause he was a criminal.
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Post by pacinoyes on Jun 29, 2020 3:09:54 GMT
Imagine not equating "Karen" with racism: Racism DEFINED: a person who shows or feels discrimination or prejudice against people of other races, or who believes that a particular race is superior to another.So where in the original posting does the person calling the man "Karen" feel superior to the actual Karen? The man was blocked from getting into his home and told that the cops were called cause he was a criminal. Not related to the original post it was a followup to JangoB who posted he felt bad for Karens and I said since it focuses on ONE race and ONE gender negatively (no one would use Karen positively) - so it's racist, sexist too. Which it is......
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Post by quetee on Jun 29, 2020 3:19:04 GMT
So where in the original posting does the person calling the man "Karen" feel superior to the actual Karen? The man was blocked from getting into his home and told that the cops were called cause he was a criminal. Not related to the original post it was a followup to JangoB who posted he felt bad for Karens and I said since it focuses on ONE race and ONE gender negatively (no one would use Karen positively) - so it's racist, sexist too. Which it is...... That explanation makes no sense. none. The video in the OP is a man calling another man a "Karen". So once again, how was that racist, if the person using the term Karen is racist to the man who is blocking him from getting into his own apartment and calling a him a criminal???
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Post by pacinoyes on Jun 29, 2020 3:25:35 GMT
Not related to the original post it was a followup to JangoB who posted he felt bad for Karens and I said since it focuses on ONE race and ONE gender negatively (no one would use Karen positively) - so it's racist, sexist too. Which it is...... That explanation makes no sense. none. The video in the OP is a man calling another man a "Karen". So once again, how was that racist, if the person using the term Karen is racist to the man who is blocking him from getting into his own apartment and calling a him a criminal??? Makes perfect sense ....lots. No one watched your OP video I didn't .........your videos bore me........the post was about the term in general which applies to 1 race and 1 gender so it is no different in race than the term "cracker" (racist) or in race and gender to "welfare mother" (racist/sexist) both racist terms and 1 racist and sexist............just like Karen is (see below). We done now? Racism DEFINED: a person who shows or feels discrimination or prejudice against people of other races, or who believes that a particular race is superior to another.
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Post by mhynson27 on Jun 29, 2020 3:26:54 GMT
Did anyone see that ludicrous display last night?
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