Good God
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Post by Good God on Mar 4, 2020 8:33:28 GMT
I know about Thompson's deposition and the NYDSS report but this report is virtually worthless. The notes of the report were destroyed, the only aspect of the report presented in court was the sworn statement of the pediatrician and panel head who never examined Dylan or spoke to Mia. There were no psychologists or psychiatrists on the panel and the judge ruled the report inadmissible. It's not evidence. I wrote this earlier and the information isn't hard to find. Are you trying to deliberately obfuscate the truth? The judge didn't rule the report as "inadmissible". The judge ruled it as "less credible" because of the "unavailability of the notes" and their "unwillingness to testify except through the deposition". No, you can't "throw that out" because it doesn't suit you. What if I "threw out" Dylan's version of the story because it wasn't even presented in court? And the Child Sexual Abuse Clinic of Yale-New Haven Hospital concluded that Dylan wasn't sexually abused. You're playing a double game here. If the judge ruling that there was no evidence of Dylan's statement being coached or rehearsed is good enough for you, the New York Department of Social Services concluding that no credible evidence of abuse or maltreatment should also be good enough for you. You can't pick and choose what suits you. If "being held up in court" is all that matters, Woody Allen is legally innocent of molesting Dylan and we're all done here.
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Good God
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Post by Good God on Mar 4, 2020 8:48:42 GMT
The Yale-New Haven report, for those who are interested:
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2020 14:40:30 GMT
No matter what you believe, I think we can all agree that the kids have been victims of a truly toxic environment - I feel sorry for all of them.
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Post by PromNightCarrie on Mar 4, 2020 14:44:21 GMT
4. Moses Farrow: "It specifically concluded that “Dylan was not abused by Mr. Allen,” that her statements had a “rehearsed quality” and that they were “likely coached or influenced by her mother.” Those conclusions perfectly match my own childhood experience: coaching, influencing, and rehearsing are three words that sum up exactly how my mother tried to raise us. I know that Dylan has recently referred to this brainwashing theory as “spin” by our father – but it was nothing of the sort. It was not only the conclusion reached by a state-ordered investigation, it was the reality of life in our household."
See not enough attention is brought to this because all over I see people taking the opposite side and I don't think they are even aware of these words. It was the reality of life in our household? Wow, worth considering if we're going to consider the other side. That's what I'm saying.
Also, so Allen suddenly decides to molest his daughter on a supervised visit in a house filled with Mia's people AFTER he left her for Soon Yi. I wasn't there, but it just smells like a set-up by a scorned woman to me.
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Post by ingmarhepburn on Mar 4, 2020 14:48:30 GMT
Just out of curiosity, does anyone here actually believe that Allen molested Dylan? I don't know, but many actors who have worked for him do. Greta Gerwig, Mira Sorvino, Ellen Page, Rebecca Hall, Timothee Chalamet... And the list goes on. These are all people who know him better than we ever will. Personally, I don't know if I should believe Dylan or not, but I've always found Allen a bit creepy and morally dubious.
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Post by JangoB on Mar 4, 2020 15:01:18 GMT
Just out of curiosity, does anyone here actually believe that Allen molested Dylan? I don't know, but many actors who have worked for him do. Greta Gerwig, Mira Sorvino, Ellen Page, Rebecca Hall, Timothee Chalamet... And the list goes on. These are all people who know him better than we ever will. Personally, I don't know if I should believe Dylan or not, but I've always found Allen a bit creepy and morally dubious. I don't think it's a case of them believing that he molested her, it's more of a I need to say the "correct" thing during the #MeToo era so I won't get cancelled routine. If they truly believed in him doing this, I doubt they would've worked with him in the first place.
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Zeb31
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Post by Zeb31 on Mar 4, 2020 15:07:08 GMT
Just out of curiosity, does anyone here actually believe that Allen molested Dylan? I don't know, but many actors who have worked for him do. Greta Gerwig, Mira Sorvino, Ellen Page, Rebecca Hall, Timothee Chalamet... And the list goes on. These are all people who know him better than we ever will. Personally, I don't know if I should believe Dylan or not, but I've always found Allen a bit creepy and morally dubious. I mean, do all these people actually believe that or are they saying what they're supposed to to save face because having worked with Allen is no longer viewed as acceptable? I don't doubt that some of them (especially the women who worked with him only once several years ago and are consistent advocates against sexual abuse) genuinely think he's guilty and a creep, but when someone who's out here condemning him and openly announcing they're donating their salary to charity was on set with the guy and singing his praises merely six months earlier, then there's no way that ostensive belief in his guilt doesn't come across as sketchy. I don't think "these people know him and they think he did it so he probably did" is a strong argument at all, especially when Allen also has prior collaborators who say the opposite and openly vouch for him like Diane Keaton, Scarlett Johansson, Javier Bardem etc. Having made a film or two with him doesn't mean these people know what happened 30 years ago, and that goes for both groups.
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Post by quetee on Mar 4, 2020 15:13:22 GMT
So your child is molested and you still want to work for the person who did it? Someone, please make that make sense.
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Zeb31
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Post by Zeb31 on Mar 4, 2020 15:26:17 GMT
No matter what you believe, I think we can all agree that the kids have been victims of a truly toxic environment - I feel sorry for all of them. Adding to this (which I wholeheartedly agree with): whether she does it voluntarily or she's coerced into doing it by her mother and siblings, the way Dylan rushes back under the spotlight every single time Allen so much as breathes in the public sphere ensures that she will never get closure from this, and she will never be able to live a healthy life that isn't defined by this trauma. It's massively fucked up how she's been condemned from the age of 7 by those responsible for her to live a life where she'll be perennially exploited by news outlets (and by her own celebrity family members) who are more than happy to sensationalize her pain because it gets them clicks and attention.
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Post by theycallmemrfish on Mar 4, 2020 15:29:49 GMT
In case anyone doesn't think that Mia lies to her children, she and Ronan have given credence the rumor that he is "possibly" Frank Sinatra's son.
Despite Frank's daughter (real daughter, not told by Mia that she's Sinatra's daughter) saying that Frank had a vasectomy FOUR YEARS BEFORE RONAN EVEN EXISTED.
And Ronan STILL as of 2019 (on Bill Maher) thinks that he's Frank's son. Like come on, you look like Woody Allen after 10 skin peels AND someone who was ACTUALLY related to the man says that it's physically impossible... but yet here you stand thinking what you're thinking because you haven't gotten past the stage where "but mommy says I" and think it's textbook.
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Post by quetee on Mar 4, 2020 21:43:24 GMT
In case anyone doesn't think that Mia lies to her children, she and Ronan have given credence the rumor that he is "possibly" Frank Sinatra's son. Despite Frank's daughter (real daughter, not told by Mia that she's Sinatra's daughter) saying that Frank had a vasectomy FOUR YEARS BEFORE RONAN EVEN EXISTED. And Ronan STILL as of 2019 (on Bill Maher) thinks that he's Frank's son. Like come on, you look like Woody Allen after 10 skin peels AND someone who was ACTUALLY related to the man says that it's physically impossible... but yet here you stand thinking what you're thinking because you haven't gotten past the stage where "but mommy says I" and think it's textbook. Hate to say it but the truth will come out when Mia has passed.
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Post by theycallmemrfish on Mar 6, 2020 6:51:26 GMT
Yeah, walking out during one of the nicest days of the year. That'll show em! I hope they stayed safe during the bitter 50 degree weather.
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Post by pacinoyes on Mar 6, 2020 10:39:57 GMT
Nothing that makes less sense - than employees of a book publisher being upset about a book actually being published - when that's like the whole point of your business. On the other hand i still can't see An Officer and A Spy in the US - and yet I also go outside for lunch everyday too - usually for a burger - and no one considers that pacinoyes' personal protest against the suppression of speech (and Art) in America ..............or the ridiculously high cost of salads. Which it is.
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Post by JangoB on Mar 6, 2020 11:10:30 GMT
'Muricans will do anything to skip work these days. I blame Greta Thunberg's example tbh.
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Lubezki
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Post by Lubezki on Mar 6, 2020 20:03:45 GMT
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LaraQ
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Post by LaraQ on Mar 6, 2020 21:30:47 GMT
This is a really bad move imo.I don't know if he's guilty or not but I know he has a right to tell his side of the story.
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Post by pacinoyes on Mar 6, 2020 22:31:57 GMT
Alrighty then, multiple copies to purchase when he self-publishes .....
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Post by pupdurcs on Mar 6, 2020 22:56:24 GMT
This is a really bad move imo.I don't know if he's guilty or not but I know he has a right to tell his side of the story. I dunno...this isn't voting or anything. I wouldn't even call it a freedom of speech issue. Nobody has the "right" to have their memoirs published at great expense by a privately owned book publisher for profit. It's a buisiness decision. Hatchette thought it would be a good business move, but when faced with so much of their workforce openly rebelling against it, quickly decided it would be bad for business. Woody Allen isn't worth the destruction of their company's morale and image with a lot of it's core customers. The higher-ups in that company should have weighed up this outcome before agreeing to this anyway. The fact that their was such a huge degree of secrecy involved suggested they already knew it wouldn't be positively recieved by even many within their company. Allen can shop it elsewhere, self-publish or put it out as a blog.
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Post by RiverleavesElmius on Mar 6, 2020 23:47:02 GMT
This is a really bad move imo.I don't know if he's guilty or not but I know he has a right to tell his side of the story. I dunno...this isn't voting or anything. I wouldn't even call it a freedom of speech issue. Nobody has the "right" to have their memoirs published at great expense by a privately owned book publisher for profit. It's a buisiness decision. Hatchette thought it would be a good business move, but when faced with so much of their workforce openly rebelling against it, quickly decided it would be bad for business. Woody Allen isn't worth the destruction of their company's morale and image with a lot of it's core customers. The higher-ups in that company should have weighed up this outcome before agreeing to this anyway. The fact that their was such a huge degree of secrecy involved suggested they already knew it wouldn't be positively recieved by even many within their company. Allen can shop it elsewhere, self-publish or put it out as a blog. 😆 Of coooourse, you can always count on this p.o.s. ScruddyPuppy to be on the wrong/pathetic/braindead side of EVERY given issue. Fucking wank! 👎
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Post by pupdurcs on Mar 6, 2020 23:52:55 GMT
I dunno...this isn't voting or anything. I wouldn't even call it a freedom of speech issue. Nobody has the "right" to have their memoirs published at great expense by a privately owned book publisher for profit. It's a buisiness decision. Hatchette thought it would be a good business move, but when faced with so much of their workforce openly rebelling against it, quickly decided it would be bad for business. Woody Allen isn't worth the destruction of their company's morale and image with a lot of it's core customers. The higher-ups in that company should have weighed up this outcome before agreeing to this anyway. The fact that their was such a huge degree of secrecy involved suggested they already knew it wouldn't be positively recieved by even many within their company. Allen can shop it elsewhere, self-publish or put it out as a blog. 😆 Of coooourse, you can always count on this p.o.s. ScruddyPuppy to be on the wrong/pathetic/braindead side of EVER given issue. Fucking wank! 👎 Insecurity is an unattractive trait dude, and you ooze it. Confident people don't need to subscribe to the same viewpoint as everyone else just to fit in. I think for myself and draw whatever conclusions I feel like....if you agree with me, cool. If not, also cool. But ultimately, I don"t give a fuck!
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Post by theycallmemrfish on Mar 7, 2020 0:50:19 GMT
I won't be surprised if the publishers balks when hit with the inevitable massive online shitstorm headed by Frank Sinatra's son. Fucking nailed it.
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Post by Tommen_Saperstein on Mar 7, 2020 3:03:55 GMT
The Yale-New Haven report, for those who are interested: Ah yes, the report that was deemed unreliable in court. from the New York Times 1993 article about Allen's custody loss: This is before Wilk concluded that there was no credible evidence to suggest Dylan was coached. Even the Connecticut state prosecutor who commissioned the Yale-New Haven investigation found the report unreliable. I wish Allen defenders would stop citing it as evidence of his innocence. It didn't hold up in court.
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Post by countjohn on Mar 7, 2020 3:56:21 GMT
Thought about posting more about the allegations and might later but just on the issue of the book there's virtually nothing that would make me support a book not being published whether I want to read it or not. Publication does not equate an endorsement of the author or the content of the book. Even if you're 100% convinced the allegations are true (which is a pretty untenable position) plenty of evil people have written books before and there's nothing wrong with that.
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Good God
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Post by Good God on Mar 7, 2020 5:44:59 GMT
Ah yes, the report that was deemed unreliable in court. from the New York Times 1993 article about Allen's custody loss: This is before Wilk concluded that there was no credible evidence to suggest Dylan was coached. Even the Connecticut state prosecutor who commissioned the Yale-New Haven investigation found the report unreliable. I wish Allen defenders would stop citing it as evidence of his innocence. It didn't hold up in court. One, you're making things up when you say, "It didn't hold up in court." All the judge said was that it was "less credible" for a couple of reasons. Two, I don't care even if it didn't hold up in court. If what held up in court is the standard here, you can also stop citing Dylan's account of the events, because it wasn't even presented in court. Heck, we should all conclude that Woody Allen is innocent because he wasn't even charged with a crime, let alone convicted. You can keep trying to play this double game and shift standards as they suit you, but it's pretty moronic. The Yale-New Haven report is an investigative report by a professional and neutral third-party team retained by the Connecticut State Police. They had no ties or relation to Woody Allen or Mia Farrow prior to their investigation. Their conclusions were drawn based on, among other things, 9 interviews with Dylan and the recording that Mia Farrow took of Dylan. They were in a far better position to judge what happened than anybody who wasn't involved in what happened, including you and me.
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Post by Tommen_Saperstein on Mar 7, 2020 6:14:07 GMT
All I know is that Woody Allen is a sex predator. We know that. That's a matter of historical record. He's likely a statutory rapist and made a habit of pursuing teenage girls from a position of influence in the film industry. He had a sexual/romantic relationship with Stacey Nelkin when he was 42 and she was 17, he tried to seduce Mariel Hemingway when she was 16, and he groomed his partner's adopted daughter when she was 17 and took nude pictures of her. I don't have any sympathy for his reputation. He's a scumbag. The world was probably a little bit safer when everyone started being more wary of him and the last thing anyone needs is his version of events unless it's a confessional. Hollywood is safer without men like Woody Allen. But leave it to the internet to be outraged when a sex predator loses a book deal. The injustice.
Have nothing else to say about this. Chalk all of Allen's professional difficulties up to karma for one thing or another.
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