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Post by mattfincher on Feb 22, 2020 15:40:12 GMT
I’m surprised no one is listing ‘The Others’ for Kidman. I’d say that and ‘Moulin Rouge!’ are her most classic films. The Others doesn’t even hit my minimum 3.7 avg. LB rating threshold and it’s definitely not popular enough with the general public.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2020 15:59:27 GMT
‘The Others’ grossed over $200 million during its theatrical run - and I think everyone is familiar with the scene with the sheets in the attic and “You’re mad, I am your daughter!”
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Post by pacinoyes on Feb 22, 2020 16:02:06 GMT
I don't know and this doesn't answer the thread question but I'd say this board way too easily tosses out the word "classic" (not to mention "iconic" and "great actor" but I digress ).
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Post by Good God on Feb 22, 2020 16:26:33 GMT
I don't know and this doesn't answer the thread question but I'd say this board way too easily tosses out the word "classic" (not to mention "iconic" and "great actor" but I digress ). Why don't you give us your list of classics for these actresses (if any of them have any at all) and perhaps your criteria for what makes a classic so some of us can maybe recalibrate our own criteria and reevaluate our choices?
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Post by pacinoyes on Feb 22, 2020 16:49:20 GMT
Well, I don't see how Pretty Woman isn't a classic (and I hate the film) or how Erin Brockovich is (and I like the film)-
It's just one of those things you know and if you have to think about it too much it probably isn't a classic tbh - movies that infiltrate the general cultural lexicon. Movies that transcend a cult of worship - there's a reason for terms like cult classic - Seconds is a cult classic, not a literal one - and some of the mentions I've seen are mere hits not classics either but ymmv.
Bullock: Gravity (1) Kidman: Moulin Rouse (1) Roberts: Pretty Woman (1) Blanchett: The Lord of the Rings Trilogy (3) Adams: Nada Theron: Mad Max: Fury Road (1) Cotillard: Inception (1) Winslet: Titanic (1)
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Post by countjohn on Feb 22, 2020 18:10:07 GMT
I mean, I don’t know how you can ignore that Pitt and DiCaprio have 4-5 films each inside the top 170 (I’ll concede giving Pitt 12 Years a Slave is dubious despite his producing contributions) from this century and Cruise’s highest ranked film is #330. He didn’t even have a film crack the Top 700 from this past decade on the century list. I’m surprised no one is listing ‘The Others’ for Kidman. I’d say that and ‘Moulin Rouge!’ are her most classic films. The Others doesn’t even hit my minimum 3.7 avg. LB rating threshold and it’s definitely not popular enough with the general public. You're way too interested in how the userbases of these websites rank movies. People don't go around in real life and say "he's a great actor because he has 5 films on the Letterboxd top list!". It's not like the Oscars where it can really effect the perception of someone, either winning themselves or starring in a BP winner.
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Post by JangoB on Feb 22, 2020 18:51:53 GMT
Determining what is a classic or not is always kind of weird because there's no real way of gauging what the general public really holds in high esteem and what slips through the cracks. Plus I think there's way too much personal preference going on when people try to point out what they think is a classic. I mean, I like "The Others" as much as the next guy but to call it a classic seems really strange. I see a lot of mentions of "Gravity" here and yes, the film is of course well-known and reasonably popular but would I call it a classic? I don't feel like it is one yet, it's way too recent. On the other hand, "Pretty Woman" seems like an undeniable classic to me, a stone cold classic of the romcom genre in particular (and no, I'm not a huge fan of it or anything). So I'll try to answer the question without tying my personal feelings about the movies to it but it's still very tough...Who knows what people hold dear these days? Sandra Bullock - I'd only say "Speed" but that seems more of a classic of a specific genre (action) than a general one. Nicole Kidman - Apart from "Moulin Rouge!" I don't see much else to mention here and even that I feel a bit unsure of. I think "Eyes Wide Shut" needs more time to become fully appreciated and maybe turn into a classic but I don't think it has hit that point yet. Julia Roberts - "Pretty Woman" for sure. Cate Blanchett - Yeah, only the "LOTR" trilogy. Amy Adams - I guess only "Catch Me if You Can" comes close. But I don't feel too sure in naming it. Although I can tell you that it's hugely popular here in Russia, it's close to being a household movie here. Not sure about its situation in the US. But I'm glad to see people mention it since it means that it has endured. Charlize Theron - In Russia it's totally "The Devil's Advocate". Overall "Mad Max: Fury Road" seems like it has already become one even though it's very recent. Marion Cotillard - "Inception" for sure. And just to once again throw in a bit of a Russian perspective, our audiences fucking love the "Taxi" franchise with the original cast, it's a total local classic over here. So we all loved Cotillard way before you lot Kate Winslet - "Titanic" and "Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind". So yeah, Winslet wins this. "Titanic" kind of destroys any of the other films here in terms of its status as a classic.
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Post by Good God on Feb 22, 2020 19:32:57 GMT
Determining what is a classic or not is always kind of weird because there's no real way of gauging what the general public really holds in high esteem and what slips through the cracks. Plus I think there's way too much personal preference going on when people try to point out what they think is a classic. I mean, I like "The Others" as much as the next guy but to call it a classic seems really strange. I see a lot of mentions of "Gravity" here and yes, the film is of course well-known and reasonably popular but would I call it a classic? I don't feel like it is one yet, it's way too recent. Yeah, I'm pretty sure The Others isn't a classic. And while I counted Gravity as a (future) classic, I think Matt (and you) may have a point that it loses a lot of its immersive power on a small screen and may not go on to become a classic. Yeah, my gut feeling was that Pretty Woman is a classic but I looked at its reviews and ratings online and couldn't really justify my gut feeling, so I took it down. Some of it this may be unquantifiable, but Pretty Woman is Roberts's defining and star-making movie that made $463M in 1990, and Roberts is arguably the biggest female movie star of all time, so it maybe has enough going for it. Yeah, that's precisely why I didn't count it. Speed, to me, is an action classic, which makes it a qualified classic and not an unqualified one. I'm actually kind of confused by the Moulin Rouge! mentions, but perhaps I'm letting my dislike of the movie influence me. Even still, it seems to only have its Best Picture nomination going for it, because its audience scores don't seem too high on IMDb. Maybe I'm missing something here. CMIYC is a cable classic here and its literally played every week on TV. According to Abagnale, it has earned Dreamworks over a billion dollars. So, yeah, it's had an insane shelf life. With the continually growing statures of DiCaprio, Hanks, and even Adams, I think it's going to stay that way.
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Post by JangoB on Feb 22, 2020 19:45:14 GMT
I'm actually kind of confused by the Moulin Rouge! mentions, but perhaps I'm letting my dislike of the movie influence me. Even still, it seems to only have its Best Picture nomination going for it, because its audience scores don't seem too high on IMDb. Maybe I'm missing something here. You know, thinking more on "Moulin Rouge!" I'm inclined to agree with you. It is very popular and of course it was the movie that brought the musicals back while also injecting new life into the genre but maybe it's not quite a classic. Which is why I wasn't sure about mentioning it in the first place. And which is why I'm slightly shocked to see Kidman share the top spot in the poll
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Post by mattfincher on Feb 22, 2020 20:41:52 GMT
I mean, I don’t know how you can ignore that Pitt and DiCaprio have 4-5 films each inside the top 170 (I’ll concede giving Pitt 12 Years a Slave is dubious despite his producing contributions) from this century and Cruise’s highest ranked film is #330. He didn’t even have a film crack the Top 700 from this past decade on the century list. The Others doesn’t even hit my minimum 3.7 avg. LB rating threshold and it’s definitely not popular enough with the general public. You're way too interested in how the userbases of these websites rank movies. People don't go around in real life and say "he's a great actor because he has 5 films on the Letterboxd top list!". It's not like the Oscars where it can really effect the perception of someone, either winning themselves or starring in a BP winner. I mean, fair. But you're arguing on behalf of something that's literally impossible to quantify. Like JangoB said, it's impossible to gauge something's popularity with the general public, especially in subsequent years after a film's release. At least in terms of the objective online polls, both with critics and online movie lovers, Cruise is lagging behind Pitt and DiCaprio. You can prefer Cruise's filmography, but I don't think there's any objective/quantifiable metric available that supports his filmography as being preferred, at least by cinephiles/critics/film historians/theorists. It might be by the general public, but you would literally never be able to prove that. I mean, The Rock's filmography might be preferred by the general public to some of these guys. But would anyone who actually gives a shit about film as an art form agree with that? Obviously not. And it's bizarre for you to bring up the Oscars when that's another thing both DiCaprio and Pitt have over Cruise. But this is why I don't like the idea of "classic," it's too relative a term and lacks nuance. The Tree of Life topped several critics poll's as the past decade's best film, but would I consider it a classic? Probably not, because the general public doesn't like it very much. I'd put Eyes Wide Shut in a similar box, even if that has at least a little more general public appeal. A lot of people have argued on behalf of Pretty Women here, but I have a hard time agreeing that a film with a 3.4 avg Letterboxd rating should be given that status. To me, a classic needs both general public approval/staying power, but also at least the veneer of prestige. I think Pretty Women lacks it. But I also understand the argument in favor of it. There's just too much gray area.
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Post by Good God on Feb 22, 2020 20:51:54 GMT
But this is why I don't like the idea of "classic," it's too relative a term and lacks nuance. The Tree of Life topped several critics poll's as the past decade's best film, but would I consider it a classic? Probably not, because the general public doesn't like it very much. I'd put Eyes Wide Shut in a similar box, even if that has at least a little more general public appeal. A lot of people have argued on behalf of Pretty Women here, but I have a hard time agreeing that a film with a 3.4 avg Letterboxd rating should be given that status. To me, a classic needs both general public approval/staying power, but also at least the veneer of prestige. I think Pretty Women lacks it. But I also understand the argument in favor of it. There's just too much gray area. I mean, people spend most of their time here talking about which movie is better and which actor is better, and that's completely subjective. At least you have something to go on when you're talking about which movie is a classic. For instance, you could say Casablanca sucks and you wouldn't be wrong. You could say it's not a classic and you'd be an idiot.
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Post by mhynson27 on Feb 23, 2020 2:15:00 GMT
‘The Others’ grossed over $200 million during its theatrical run - and I think everyone is familiar with the scene with the sheets in the attic and “You’re mad, I am your daughter!”Not even remotely.
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Post by Pittsnogle_Goggins on Feb 23, 2020 2:43:03 GMT
‘The Others’ grossed over $200 million during its theatrical run - and I think everyone is familiar with the scene with the sheets in the attic and “You’re mad, I am your daughter!”Not even remotely. Agreed in terms of the general public. If I went into the lunchroom at work and asked I doubt more than a couple of people would be.
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Post by Pittsnogle_Goggins on Feb 23, 2020 2:52:19 GMT
I’m going to consider “classics” in this case to be that the majority of general public in most settings would be in agreement.
Bullock: Speed, maybe Miss Congeniality Kidman: Moulin Rouge! Roberts: Pretty Woman, Ocean’s Eleven, maybe Erin Brokovich and Hook Blanchett: The Lord of the Rings Trilogy (3) Adams: None Theron: Mad Max: Fury Road Cotillard: Inception Winslet: Titanic, Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind
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Post by mhynson27 on Feb 23, 2020 4:55:00 GMT
Agreed in terms of the general public. If I went into the lunchroom at work and asked I doubt more than a couple of people would be. Exactly. Like no one in my family would be familiar with those moments or even the movie itself and actually come to think of it, before I saw The Others, I didn't even know about those moments.
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Post by tastytomatoes on Feb 27, 2020 12:21:38 GMT
Sandra Bullock: I don't consider Speed and hard to see Gravity become a classic. (0) Nicole Kidman: None :/ I recall liking The Others but unfortunately do not recall the quote as Tyler mentioned above. (0) Julia Roberts: Pretty Woman, Ocean's Eleven. Nothing about Erin Brokovich would make it become a classic despite Robert's excellent performance. (2) Cate Blanchett: LOTRs Trilogy, The Curious Case of Benjamin Button (2) Amy Adams: Catch Me If You Can, Her. I don't see Arrival becoming a classic, yet. (2) Charlize Theron: Mad Max Fury Road (1) Marion Cotillard: Inception, The Dark Knight Rises (2) Kate Winslet: Titanic, Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind (2) So, it's a toss up between 4 people, although if we consider the actor's presence in their "classics", then it's between Blanchett and Winslet.
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Post by fiosnasiob on Feb 27, 2020 17:44:10 GMT
There is several declinaisons of the word "classic" imo, it can be a tricky exercise, depending how flexible you are/want to be, how old you are, where do you live, etc...
Bullock : Speed, barely, thanks to it being made when it was being made.. Kidman : Moulin Rouge Roberts : Pretty Woman Blanchett : The Lord of the Rings Trilogy Adams : None and I'm surprised by the almost unanimous mention of Catch Me If You Can (here and for Leo/Hanks as well). Theron : Mad Max: Fury Road Cotillard : Inception (Taxi for French...and Russian apparently). Winslet : Titanic, Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind
So, Kate wins.
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