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Post by DeepArcher on Oct 6, 2018 21:23:05 GMT
Did you miss the scene where Jack drunkenly wanders in while she's in the bathtub, calls her messy, says she's too worried about what everyone else thinks (a pretty direct reference to her image I'd say especially since this comes right after her SNL performance), and calls her ugly? Well, I clearly didn't miss the scene considering that's the exact one I was directly referencing. I dunno, I didn't take the "ugly" comment or anything to be a criticism of her image so much as Jack drunkenly, angrily lashing out at her by exploiting something he knows she's self-conscious about. It certainly makes sense to take the comment that way, though, so maybe I stand corrected. But still, the bathtub confrontation is literally the only scene that any of these conflicts come to surface ... like nearly everything else about this movie, the idea is too damn under-developed.
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Post by DeepArcher on Oct 6, 2018 21:32:08 GMT
Yeah, that argument scene really rang false for me. I think there was definitely an undercurrent that Elliott and Cooper brought to their dynamic that made it believable, but I really didn't like that particular confrontation in terms of staging or plot. Bobby knew that Jack was drunk when he told him about the ranch sale, and if Jack has a propensity to forget things while under the influence (which never really comes up again in the film, if memory serves; Jack's blitzed a fair bit throughout the film yet he seems to remember most things, certainly enough to galvanize an entire relationship out of it), why would he expect that a.) Jack would remember after telling him about selling the ranch, and b.) if he knew it was a sore subject in the first place, why not tell him while Jack was sober and understood that the bones were washed away in the flood? So much of this film had confrontation built into it purely for the sake of convenience. Bobby has to leave so that Jack loses his "anchor" (even though Bobby was a shitty anchor) and has to rely more and more on Ally (which he never really does, because the story focuses more on her growth as an artist and how he's becoming an albatross rather than an anchor for her), but the ruin that Jack brings to Ally's reputation ("She looks like a jerk staying with you.") never feels like it matters at all to Ally, and that while being supportive to her suffering spouse is commendable, it feels out of character for the woman who had a private freakout in a bathroom in her first scene and who got into a bar fight within five minutes of meeting Jack. I don't buy for a second that Ally would stick with him so forgivingly, love or no love.Things like this aggravate the hell out of me because there is so much that the film does right, but there's an awful lot that feels like freshman-level storytelling, hamfistedly squashed in between two strong bookends. EXACTLY. The entire second half of the movie I was thinking, "There is no way this marriage would last in reality." It didn't really surprise me that it did considering the entire movie struck me as disingenuous, but yeah, that bothered the hell out of me. As you said, it doesn't feel in-character for Ally to put up with him for as long as she does, and that's not to mention it could've been pretty damn powerful to see Ally cut ties with Jack for the sake of her career and her own life. It's a point that I'd almost argue the story was naturally building to, and yet it doesn't happen.
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Post by stephen on Oct 6, 2018 21:44:05 GMT
EXACTLY. The entire second half of the movie I was thinking, "There is no way this marriage would last in reality." It didn't really surprise me that it did considering the entire movie struck me as disingenuous, but yeah, that bothered the hell out of me. As you said, it doesn't feel in-character for Ally to put up with him for as long as she does, and that's not to mention it could've been pretty damn powerful to see Ally cut ties with Jack for the sake of her career and her own life. It's a point that I'd almost argue the story was naturally building to, and yet it doesn't happen. I know it's stupid to try and put the "it was all a dream/in so-and-so's head" perspective on a movie for the sake of making it cooler, but I actually think this whole movie makes more sense if it's all in Ally's head after her one night with Jack, and after refusing to go with him to the concert, she builds it up in her head the life and opportunities she could've had.
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Post by DeepArcher on Oct 6, 2018 21:52:13 GMT
I know it's stupid to try and put the "it was all a dream/in so-and-so's head" perspective on a movie for the sake of making it cooler, but I actually think this whole movie makes more sense if it's all in Ally's head after her one night with Jack, and after refusing to go with him to the concert, she builds it up in her head the life and opportunities she could've had. You know, there's definitely a way that angle could've worked. It would've been pretty fascinating to "modernize" a story arc as outdated as this one by showing it as something that could only exist in fantasy. Plus, could you imagine if this movie took a Mulholland Dr.-esque turn with twenty minutes to go? I feel like I would've loved that.
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Post by amiableamy on Oct 7, 2018 1:11:05 GMT
I found it quite good! I was really impressed with Cooper, his performance moved me, which is something pretty rare for a film performer to do it. I'm sure Gaga will get most of the hype (which makes sense), but he should certainly be in contention for Best Actor.
I thought the whole thing was going to be a shitshow when it was announced. Very happy to be wrong.
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Post by Billy_Costigan on Oct 7, 2018 4:04:23 GMT
As a side-note: can we also all agree that one friend of Ally's dad (you know which one) is the perfect guy to play Steve Bannon in the inevitable miniseries about the current administration? I couldn't think of anything else when he first came on screen!
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Post by Billy_Costigan on Oct 7, 2018 4:15:54 GMT
My favorite film of the year. Pure cinema. The ending crushed me (I haven't seen the previous versions and tried to go in blind). Cooper and Gaga have next level chemistry. The first performance of Shallow felt like an iconic movie moment.
This is Cooper's best performance and one that should win him the Oscar. Authentic, raw, and heartbreaking.
Lady Gaga in A Star is Born > Emma Stone in La La Land
10/10
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Post by Ryan_MYeah on Oct 7, 2018 4:23:02 GMT
Lady Gaga in A Star is Born > Emma Stone in La La Land Oh, them’s fightin’ words.
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Post by Billy_Costigan on Oct 7, 2018 4:24:52 GMT
With A Star Is Born, we never really get a sense of Jackson having any resentment towards a specific type of genre, or that he even resented "selling out" (remember, this is the dude who was performing for pharmacists). The only time the film pays any sort of lip service to this is Ally's lack of confidence about her nose, but Jack tells her that she's beautiful nevertheless. But at no point do we see Jack's own art form suffering beyond his physical limitations, which everybody basically kowtows to until he is replaced at the Orbison tribute, and for moments like Jack mumbling about how Ally didn't "win" her Grammy . . . it just feels like a great deal was left on the cutting room floor. I don't mind it when a director abides by "show, don't tell", but Cooper neither showed nor told us there, and the key conceit of the film really comes up lacking. It forces the audiences to fill in the gaps, which is fine for connective tissue but not when there are bones in the skeleton missing. I mean, I thought it was at least pretty clear that he thought her new image was bullshit and that she had abandoned her original artistic voice. I actually liked that the film didn't dwell too much on that dimension of the story and his jealousy toward her success, because that mid section was probably the least interesting part of the film for me. The first third and the last third were the strongest parts of the film imo. I agree. He questioned her songs and was always focused on "having something to say." It was telling that she went back to her natural hair color for her final performance.
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Film Socialism
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Post by Film Socialism on Oct 7, 2018 5:49:45 GMT
is this supposed 2 be good
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Post by Allenism on Oct 7, 2018 12:47:44 GMT
Lady Gaga in A Star is Born > Emma Stone in La La Land 10/10 That’s not really saying much, though. (I haven’t seen ASIB yet)
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Post by Pittsnogle_Goggins on Oct 7, 2018 16:35:15 GMT
Lady Gaga in A Star is Born > Emma Stone in La La Land Oh, them’s fightin’ words. They may be fightin’ words but it’s also correct.
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Post by stephen on Oct 7, 2018 16:37:04 GMT
Oh, them’s fightin’ words. They may be fightin’ words but it’s also correct. Nah, man. Gaga might have better pipes/songs, but Stone beats her like a rented mule's redheaded stepchild (and I say that as someone who thought Gaga was for the most part very strong in her film).
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Post by Deleted on Oct 7, 2018 17:55:36 GMT
Lady Gaga in A Star is Born > Emma Stone in La La Land 10/10 That’s not really saying much, though. (I haven’t seen ASIB yet) It's definitely not true. Gaga is fine, acting-wise (her singing is, of course, brilliant), but this is Cooper's show.
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Post by Billy_Costigan on Oct 7, 2018 19:33:39 GMT
That’s not really saying much, though. (I haven’t seen ASIB yet) It's definitely not true. Gaga is fine, acting-wise (her singing is, of course, brilliant), but this is Cooper's show. La La Land is one of my favorite movies so I don't have anything against Emma but I was super impressed with Gaga. She better get nominated.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 7, 2018 19:37:11 GMT
It's definitely not true. Gaga is fine, acting-wise (her singing is, of course, brilliant), but this is Cooper's show. La La Land is one of my favorite movies so I don't have anything against Emma but I was super impressed with Gaga. She better get nominated. The film is locked across the board. No worries there. But if Gaga beats Glenn Close, I might actually seethe.
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filmnoir
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Post by filmnoir on Oct 7, 2018 19:58:59 GMT
My favorite film of the year. Pure cinema. The ending crushed me (I haven't seen the previous versions and tried to go in blind). Cooper and Gaga have next level chemistry. The first performance of Shallow felt like an iconic movie moment. This is Cooper's best performance and one that should win him the Oscar. Authentic, raw, and heartbreaking. Lady Gaga in A Star is Born > Emma Stone in La La Land The comparison with Emma Stone and La La Land really isn't relevant. Different films, different characters.
That said, every review says this version of ASIB is better than the 1976 Streisand film. And at the time, she was the #1 box office female star.
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Post by quetee on Oct 7, 2018 20:29:57 GMT
La La Land is one of my favorite movies so I don't have anything against Emma but I was super impressed with Gaga. She better get nominated. The film is locked across the board. No worries there. But if Gaga beats Glenn Close, I might actually seethe. Glenn still has Sunset Blvd.
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Post by Tommen_Saperstein on Oct 7, 2018 21:00:29 GMT
Saw it this morning. Really really liked it. The midsection dragged a bit and felt like it was going through the motions, but it's sandwiched between a phenomenal beginning and end. Gaga was outstanding in a very vulnerable role (and such a fitting one for her, this movie parallels her rise to stardom and artistic journey in so many ways), but Bradley Cooper was NEXT LEVEL. In the hands of a lesser actor Cooper's decisions would have felt totally affectatious and disingenuous (my first impression was that he was doing his best Jeff Bridges impersonation), but he creates a distinct, full-bodied, and original character and breathes life into him. It's unlike anything he's done before and it works on every level. I take back my Redford prediction. I didn't realize from the marketing how showy Cooper's role was and he totally knocks it out of the park. My money's on him and it's staying on him.
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Post by Tommen_Saperstein on Oct 7, 2018 21:42:02 GMT
Lady Gaga in A Star is Born > Emma Stone in La La Land true, but can't I love them both?
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Post by theycallmemrfish on Oct 7, 2018 21:47:13 GMT
Holy crap, this made $40M this weekend.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 7, 2018 21:48:07 GMT
La La Land is one of my favorite movies so I don't have anything against Emma but I was super impressed with Gaga. She better get nominated. The film is locked across the board. No worries there. But if Gaga beats Glenn Close, I might actually seethe. You just know its going to be the outcome.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 7, 2018 21:52:58 GMT
The film is locked across the board. No worries there. But if Gaga beats Glenn Close, I might actually seethe. You just know its going to be the outcome. I'm going to remain optimistic!
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Post by pacinoyes on Oct 8, 2018 11:11:02 GMT
I saw this at a late night (Sunday) packed show and there were clearly people in the theater who had already seen it and loved it. I would say this is an example of a checklist film or check off all the boxes film rather, some moviegoers want this and only this from their movies and for them, it's the equivalent of a satisfying meal.
It's also pretty good, particularly in its set up where attractive people are attractive together because they (somehow!) don't realize how attractive they are. Later, as it goes on way too long to its glum but triumphant finale -that switch has gone off in my head that says "Enough"
If you didn't know this was an Oscar player, you wouldn't know it by the film itself. Performances are strong but not great, songs are adequately good enough to be believable as "hits" but nothing you would cling to (I don't anyway).........Cooper has now clearly delineated what he's "good" at - and that's in being the stand by your girl dude in romantic films - his two best performances are here and in SLP, both of which he was shown up by the female lead anyway.
He may actually deserve the nod that everyone thinks he's winning for this time......direction was solid and special in the musical framing of those songs.
7/10 or so......
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Post by thomasjerome on Oct 8, 2018 13:37:55 GMT
I didn't care for the trailer at all but I have to admit, this was surprisingly good. Never really cared for Cooper much before but he's great here. GaGa is also effective and Elliott leaves a strong impact with the material he's got (hope he'll get a nom). The music sequences were particular highlight.
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