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Post by TerryMontana on Nov 21, 2019 6:24:46 GMT
It is supposed to be the best Joker origin story and some scenes (Barbara Gordon, the red hood etc) are considered classic. I just found them ugly. The Barbara stuff was sadistic, the red hood stuff was boring, and I don't understand what Joker was going for. The whole story was just an excuse to be gross. Iirc Joker was going for some extra money and these guys also threatened him about his pregnant wife. Again, maybe I remember wrong. And the whole Barbara thing was also part of Gordon "going crazy".
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Post by jimmalone on Nov 21, 2019 10:25:29 GMT
Kniv by Jo Nesbo
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Post by TerryMontana on Nov 21, 2019 11:28:19 GMT
Is that Harry Hole's Knife?
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Post by jimmalone on Nov 21, 2019 11:29:46 GMT
Is that Harry Hole's Knife? Indeed.
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Post by Martin Stett on Nov 21, 2019 16:58:56 GMT
I just found them ugly. The Barbara stuff was sadistic, the red hood stuff was boring, and I don't understand what Joker was going for. The whole story was just an excuse to be gross. Iirc Joker was going for some extra money and these guys also threatened him about his pregnant wife. Again, maybe I remember wrong. And the whole Barbara thing was also part of Gordon "going crazy". I meant Joker's plan to make Gordon go crazy. It just seemed stupid imo. I would have thought that Joker's evil plan would be more thought out than "show Gordon photos of Barbara's abuse and hope for the best." I also think that the Red Hood just doesn't connect with the main story at all. It isn't necessarily bad by itself, but there's no link to the "one bad day" idea that Joker keeps pushing. It's a succession of bad days that ends in silly coincidence. Seemed like a needless, unfunny shaggy dog story to me.
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Post by TerryMontana on Nov 21, 2019 17:22:10 GMT
Iirc Joker was going for some extra money and these guys also threatened him about his pregnant wife. Again, maybe I remember wrong. And the whole Barbara thing was also part of Gordon "going crazy". I meant Joker's plan to make Gordon go crazy. It just seemed stupid imo. I would have thought that Joker's evil plan would be more thought out than "show Gordon photos of Barbara's abuse and hope for the best." I also think that the Red Hood just doesn't connect with the main story at all. It isn't necessarily bad by itself, but there's no link to the "one bad day" idea that Joker keeps pushing. It's a succession of bad days that ends in silly coincidence. Seemed like a needless, unfunny shaggy dog story to me. I agree it was not only "one bad day" but I liked this concept. It only takes one bad day and that's all. As for the red hood plot, iirc it doesn't necessarily connect to this concept. It's just the origin story of Joker. And it was the very first time there was an origin story for him in comic books. Not one made from the DC usual writers or anything, not a "canon", so to speak. Just an Alan Moore idea. And after that, this Joker's origin became classic.
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Post by Martin Stett on Nov 21, 2019 17:32:47 GMT
I meant Joker's plan to make Gordon go crazy. It just seemed stupid imo. I would have thought that Joker's evil plan would be more thought out than "show Gordon photos of Barbara's abuse and hope for the best." I also think that the Red Hood just doesn't connect with the main story at all. It isn't necessarily bad by itself, but there's no link to the "one bad day" idea that Joker keeps pushing. It's a succession of bad days that ends in silly coincidence. Seemed like a needless, unfunny shaggy dog story to me. I agree it was not only "one bad day" but I liked this concept. It only takes one bad day and that's all. As for the red hood plot, iirc it doesn't necessarily connect to this concept. It's just the origin story of Joker. And it was the very first time there was an origin story for him in comic books. Not one made from the DC usual writers or anything, not a "canon", so to speak. Just an Alan Moore idea. And after that, this Joker's origin became classic. Therein lies the problem of a lot of the story to me. It is aimless and overlong despite its very short length. Which would be fine if the story wasn't sadistic garbage meant to shock and nothing more. If you were actually telling a story about people, I'd be fine with some aimlessness... but grotesquerie is the whole point of this story. I've never read a Batman comic before, but I've seen movies, played video games, I watched TAS as a kid (tried it again recently but didn't care for it much). When I compare this to Telltale Batman, that is a game that tells a story about Bruce Wayne and the kind of man he wants to be vs. the kind of man Batman inherently is, and how he has to wrestle with how both Batman and Bruce have caused harm to people and the city he loves. Arkham Asylum doesn't have that heart, but the Joker's ramblings are funny and the whole thing put a smile on my face because fun was put first. In TKJ, viciousness is put first, and there is nothing underneath.
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Post by TerryMontana on Nov 21, 2019 20:11:58 GMT
I agree it was not only "one bad day" but I liked this concept. It only takes one bad day and that's all. As for the red hood plot, iirc it doesn't necessarily connect to this concept. It's just the origin story of Joker. And it was the very first time there was an origin story for him in comic books. Not one made from the DC usual writers or anything, not a "canon", so to speak. Just an Alan Moore idea. And after that, this Joker's origin became classic. Therein lies the problem of a lot of the story to me. It is aimless and overlong despite its very short length. Which would be fine if the story wasn't sadistic garbage meant to shock and nothing more. If you were actually telling a story about people, I'd be fine with some aimlessness... but grotesquerie is the whole point of this story. I've never read a Batman comic before, but I've seen movies, played video games, I watched TAS as a kid (tried it again recently but didn't care for it much). When I compare this to Telltale Batman, that is a game that tells a story about Bruce Wayne and the kind of man he wants to be vs. the kind of man Batman inherently is, and how he has to wrestle with how both Batman and Bruce have caused harm to people and the city he loves. Arkham Asylum doesn't have that heart, but the Joker's ramblings are funny and the whole thing put a smile on my face because fun was put first. In TKJ, viciousness is put first, and there is nothing underneath. Indeed there were two separate timelines and I can agree with you the present timeline was shocking and sadistic. I guess it's all about that "one bad day" concept. If you dig it, then you'll love the novel (it's built around it). If you find it cheesy and cheap you're gonna hate it. I can't remember many details after all these years, plus I don't play video games so I can't compare it with Asylum and Telltale. But I loved TAS as a kid
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Post by Deleted on Nov 24, 2019 8:04:43 GMT
Decided to read Brothers Karamazov next and am about 100 pages in. Fantastic book so far, to compare it to films I'd say it feels like an insane mesh of Ingmar Bergman's thematic interests and characters (and how they interact, with others and themselves), Barry Lyndon, and Hitchcock in how it's playing with morality.
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Post by jimmalone on Nov 24, 2019 13:25:52 GMT
Decided to read Brothers Karamazov next and am about 100 pages in. Fantastic book so far, to compare it to films I'd say it feels like an insane mesh of Ingmar Bergman's thematic interests and characters (and how they interact, with others and themselves), Barry Lyndon, and Hitchcock in how it's playing with morality. I think the comparison with Bergman is pretty spot on, that's what I felt as well, when reading it. Never thought about Hitchock, but now that I think of it I can definitely see similarities as well. Though mainly obviously it just felt like... Dostoyevsky.
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Post by jimmalone on Nov 24, 2019 13:26:09 GMT
Norman Mailer - The Deer Park
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Post by Mattsby on Nov 25, 2019 20:02:28 GMT
Whip Hand (1961) - Charles Willeford, under pseudonym. My eighth Willy read this year, he's become one of my fav writers. Not as perfectly concise as Wild Wives and High Priest of California, not as deep and brilliant as Understudy for Death and Pick-Up. But worth reading for fans bc here he's switching narrators every chapter, some are female, and using dialect too which I don't always like but it works here - it all works even when it stretches plausibility. It's hectic, kinky at times, and extremely worryingly violent.....
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Post by Martin Stett on Nov 26, 2019 21:08:46 GMT
Three chapters into Torso by Brian Michael Bendis and Marc Andreyko.
The art style throws me off a little bit: it's atmospheric, engaging and scary... but it can be hard to tell what is going on, or who the different characters are (the chiaroscuro makes faces interchangeable). The characters are fine, but I'd like more development that I fear won't happen. I love some of the unusual panel layouts (playing around with perspective is one of my favorite capabilities of the graphic novel medium). The story is pretty great on the plot level: it never flags or loses its momentum for a second. So I'm definitely digging it.
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Post by stephen on Nov 26, 2019 22:27:13 GMT
Three chapters into Torso by Brian Michael Bendis and Marc Andreyko. The art style throws me off a little bit: it's atmospheric, engaging and scary... but it can be hard to tell what is going on, or who the different characters are (the chiaroscuro makes faces interchangeable). The characters are fine, but I'd like more development that I fear won't happen. I love some of the unusual panel layouts (playing around with perspective is one of my favorite capabilities of the graphic novel medium). The story is pretty great on the plot level: it never flags or loses its momentum for a second. So I'm definitely digging it. Yeah, the art style can be a bit alienating, but you get used to it. But imagine what the cinematography on a feature film would look like with all that chiaroscuro!
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Post by pacinoyes on Nov 30, 2019 19:09:18 GMT
A Judgment In Stone - Ruth RendellThe book La Cérémonie is based on which I love beyond all proportion .......a swift, satisfying and on-target read.
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Post by Martin Stett on Nov 30, 2019 19:17:11 GMT
Finished Torso, which fizzled out at the end big time. Gonna try the mammoth epic poem The Kalevala (Kirby translation) again. I really dug it when I tried reading it before, but I didn't have time to dedicate and had to drop it. I have a looser schedule coming up, so once more into the adventures of Vainamoinen and company.
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Post by jimmalone on Dec 1, 2019 12:23:22 GMT
Boris Pasternak - Doctor Zhivago
It was definitely overdue that I read this.
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Post by TerryMontana on Dec 3, 2019 6:24:31 GMT
Just started Casino Royal by Ian Fleming.
It's the first James Bond book translated in my language!!!
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Post by jimmalone on Dec 3, 2019 11:19:33 GMT
Just started Casino Royal by Ian Fleming. It's the first James Bond book translated in my language!!! It's also the first novel in the original series.
Or do you possibly mean that it was only now translated into your language??
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Post by TerryMontana on Dec 3, 2019 12:33:55 GMT
Just started Casino Royal by Ian Fleming. It's the first James Bond book translated in my language!!! It's also the first novel in the original series.
Or do you possibly mean that it was only now translated into your language??
That's what I mean. First time a Bind novel translated into my language. But I know it's also the first of the series.
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Post by jimmalone on Dec 3, 2019 13:02:35 GMT
It's also the first novel in the original series.
Or do you possibly mean that it was only now translated into your language??
That's what I mean. First time a Bind novel translated into my language. But I know it's also the first of the series. Where do you live if I'm allowed to ask?
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Post by Martin Stett on Dec 3, 2019 14:01:22 GMT
That's what I mean. First time a Bind novel translated into my language. But I know it's also the first of the series. Where do you live if I'm allowed to ask? I do believe he lives in , judging from some of his other comments.
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Post by TerryMontana on Dec 3, 2019 14:29:14 GMT
That's what I mean. First time a Bind novel translated into my language. But I know it's also the first of the series. Where do you live if I'm allowed to ask? Yes, it's Greece. I've said it a few times before.
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Post by evilbliss on Dec 3, 2019 16:22:43 GMT
Where do you live if I'm allowed to ask? Yes, it's Greece. I've said it a few times before. I know how to say 'thank you' in Greek like I was born there! At least that's what they said. Also: Greek men are the most sexy I've ever seen.
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Zeb31
Based
Bernardo is not believing que vous êtes come to bing bing avec nous
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Post by Zeb31 on Dec 3, 2019 16:42:16 GMT
About to finish I'm Thinking of Ending Things by Iain Reid, which Charlie Kaufman adapted into a new film coming out next year.
Kind of a mindfuck so far, has anyone else read it?
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