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Post by HELENA MARIA on Apr 26, 2019 18:45:21 GMT
What are your thoughts on that subject ?
I firmly believe that it is the parents' responsibility to raise their kids as either boys or girls and see how they develop into adulthood. Then they can maturely make any decision they'd like.
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cherry68
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Post by cherry68 on Apr 26, 2019 18:58:44 GMT
What's that? I mean, I always allowed my (male) kids to choose the toys they liked, dolls or cars or bricks. But I never dressed them with a skirt.
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Post by Tommen_Saperstein on Apr 26, 2019 19:11:55 GMT
Gonna say no
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Zeb31
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Post by Zeb31 on Apr 26, 2019 19:29:35 GMT
What do you mean by that, though? It's a pretty undefined concept that can lean multiple ways.
If it's raising kids using they/them pronouns from birth and not referring to them as boys/girls at all then no, but what I actually see associated with "gender-neutral parenting" is perfectly reasonable stuff like not shoving models of behavior down everybody's throats from the moment you get an ultrasound and letting the kids choose what colors, toys, activities etc. they're interested in and letting them explore that freely without restricting it or punishing them based on rigid notions of what's "for boys" and what's "for girls". I tend to hang out with pretty SJWy sorts, and the most radical gender-neutral parenting I've ever heard anyone talk about is like being okay with baby boys wearing pink sometimes and not freaking out if a girl likes toy trucks and sports.
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Post by theycallmemrfish on Apr 26, 2019 19:53:00 GMT
I mean, the whole "X is for boys!" and "Y is for girls!" is practically dead by now. I see boys wear pink, girls play rougher sports, boys who love to cook, and it goes on and on and on. It still exists somewhat, but it's not nearly as prevalent as it once was.
The whole child pronoun bullshit is ridiculous, though. It's a fucking baby, it doesn't even know if it's hungry or needs to take a shit-- let alone what pronoun it would like to be called.
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Zeb31
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Post by Zeb31 on Apr 26, 2019 22:07:39 GMT
I mean, the whole "X is for boys!" and "Y is for girls!" is practically dead by now. I see boys wear pink, girls play rougher sports, boys who love to cook, and it goes on and on and on. It still exists somewhat, but it's not nearly as prevalent as it once was. Eh, I think that still varies depending on where you are. In my family the notion of a baby girl (I'm talking like <6 months here) going out in public without some clear signifier of girlhood like earrings or a hair bow is an immediate no-no, because having your baby mistaken for the opposite sex is a legitimately scary possibility. So yeah, that binary notion is very much alive and well in some places, which means that the whole umbrella of gender-neutral parenting is (as I understand it) mostly comprised of things that should just be basic common sense. Here's another anecdote no one asked for: I was at a kid's birthday party a few months ago. It was Frozen-themed and they even had entertainers dressed up as Elsa and Anna. Really early on in the party, the only children that had arrived were like 4 girls and 1 boy. The girls were all playing among themselves and having fun, while the boy was sat in a corner by himself looking sad. Elsa went up to him and asked what was wrong, and he said he couldn't join the girls because they were drawing and coloring, and both those things (as well as Frozen) are for girls, so he had to wait for another boy to arrive so they could do something else together. And it made me so angry that this 4-year-old was consciously making himself miserable and refusing to do something he clearly wanted to do (and which he ultimately did after Elsa sat down and talked to him for a while), all because he was taught that fucking coloring is too girly. That's what I think of when people talk of gender-neutral parenting, not pronouns.
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Post by mhynson27 on Apr 27, 2019 5:03:51 GMT
I mean, the whole "X is for boys!" and "Y is for girls!" is practically dead by now. I see boys wear pink, girls play rougher sports, boys who love to cook, and it goes on and on and on. It still exists somewhat, but it's not nearly as prevalent as it once was. Eh, I think that still varies depending on where you are. In my family the notion of a baby girl (I'm talking like <6 months here) going out in public without some clear signifier of girlhood like earrings or a hair bow is an immediate no-no, because having your baby mistaken for the opposite sex is a legitimately scary possibility. So yeah, that binary notion is very much alive and well in some places, which means that the whole umbrella of gender-neutral parenting is (as I understand it) mostly comprised of things that should just be basic common sense. Here's another anecdote no one asked for: I was at a kid's birthday party a few months ago. It was Frozen-themed and they even had entertainers dressed up as Elsa and Anna. Really early on in the party, the only children that had arrived were like 4 girls and 1 boy. The girls were all playing among themselves and having fun, while the boy was sat in a corner by himself looking sad. Elsa went up to him and asked what was wrong, and he said he couldn't join the girls because they were drawing and coloring, and both those things (as well as Frozen) are for girls, so he had to wait for another boy to arrive so they could do something else together. And it made me so angry that this 4-year-old was consciously making himself miserable and refusing to do something he clearly wanted to do (and which he ultimately did after Elsa sat down and talked to him for a while), all because he was taught that fucking coloring is too girly. That's what I think of when people talk of gender-neutral parenting, not pronouns. Who the fuck puts earrings on a baby???
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Zeb31
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Post by Zeb31 on Apr 27, 2019 14:39:33 GMT
Eh, I think that still varies depending on where you are. In my family the notion of a baby girl (I'm talking like <6 months here) going out in public without some clear signifier of girlhood like earrings or a hair bow is an immediate no-no, because having your baby mistaken for the opposite sex is a legitimately scary possibility. So yeah, that binary notion is very much alive and well in some places, which means that the whole umbrella of gender-neutral parenting is (as I understand it) mostly comprised of things that should just be basic common sense. Here's another anecdote no one asked for: I was at a kid's birthday party a few months ago. It was Frozen-themed and they even had entertainers dressed up as Elsa and Anna. Really early on in the party, the only children that had arrived were like 4 girls and 1 boy. The girls were all playing among themselves and having fun, while the boy was sat in a corner by himself looking sad. Elsa went up to him and asked what was wrong, and he said he couldn't join the girls because they were drawing and coloring, and both those things (as well as Frozen) are for girls, so he had to wait for another boy to arrive so they could do something else together. And it made me so angry that this 4-year-old was consciously making himself miserable and refusing to do something he clearly wanted to do (and which he ultimately did after Elsa sat down and talked to him for a while), all because he was taught that fucking coloring is too girly. That's what I think of when people talk of gender-neutral parenting, not pronouns. Who the fuck puts earrings on a baby??? Piercing infants' ears is very much a thing.
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Post by theycallmemrfish on Apr 27, 2019 15:39:09 GMT
I mean, the whole "X is for boys!" and "Y is for girls!" is practically dead by now. I see boys wear pink, girls play rougher sports, boys who love to cook, and it goes on and on and on. It still exists somewhat, but it's not nearly as prevalent as it once was. Eh, I think that still varies depending on where you are. In my family the notion of a baby girl (I'm talking like <6 months here) going out in public without some clear signifier of girlhood like earrings or a hair bow is an immediate no-no, because having your baby mistaken for the opposite sex is a legitimately scary possibility. So yeah, that binary notion is very much alive and well in some places, which means that the whole umbrella of gender-neutral parenting is (as I understand it) mostly comprised of things that should just be basic common sense. Here's another anecdote no one asked for: I was at a kid's birthday party a few months ago. It was Frozen-themed and they even had entertainers dressed up as Elsa and Anna. Really early on in the party, the only children that had arrived were like 4 girls and 1 boy. The girls were all playing among themselves and having fun, while the boy was sat in a corner by himself looking sad. Elsa went up to him and asked what was wrong, and he said he couldn't join the girls because they were drawing and coloring, and both those things (as well as Frozen) are for girls, so he had to wait for another boy to arrive so they could do something else together. And it made me so angry that this 4-year-old was consciously making himself miserable and refusing to do something he clearly wanted to do (and which he ultimately did after Elsa sat down and talked to him for a while), all because he was taught that fucking coloring is too girly. That's what I think of when people talk of gender-neutral parenting, not pronouns. I never saw that at all growing up nor now. Coloring is fun. I distinctly remember both the boys and the girls in class (in the long, long ago) would be absolutely envious of anyone who came to school rocking one of these bad-boys: (I couldn't find the one with the crayon sharpener and the tiered levels... which was basically the Rolls' Royce of elementary school)
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Post by mhynson27 on Apr 27, 2019 15:48:18 GMT
Who the fuck puts earrings on a baby??? Piercing infants' ears is very much a thing. That's fucked.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 27, 2019 19:06:05 GMT
No. They already give them ridiculous names, give them a break from being extra bullied.
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Post by Pittsnogle_Goggins on Apr 28, 2019 21:00:35 GMT
I mean, the whole "X is for boys!" and "Y is for girls!" is practically dead by now. I see boys wear pink, girls play rougher sports, boys who love to cook, and it goes on and on and on. It still exists somewhat, but it's not nearly as prevalent as it once was. Eh, I think that still varies depending on where you are. In my family the notion of a baby girl (I'm talking like <6 months here) going out in public without some clear signifier of girlhood like earrings or a hair bow is an immediate no-no, because having your baby mistaken for the opposite sex is a legitimately scary possibility. So yeah, that binary notion is very much alive and well in some places, which means that the whole umbrella of gender-neutral parenting is (as I understand it) mostly comprised of things that should just be basic common sense. Here's another anecdote no one asked for: I was at a kid's birthday party a few months ago. It was Frozen-themed and they even had entertainers dressed up as Elsa and Anna. Really early on in the party, the only children that had arrived were like 4 girls and 1 boy. The girls were all playing among themselves and having fun, while the boy was sat in a corner by himself looking sad. Elsa went up to him and asked what was wrong, and he said he couldn't join the girls because they were drawing and coloring, and both those things (as well as Frozen) are for girls, so he had to wait for another boy to arrive so they could do something else together. And it made me so angry that this 4-year-old was consciously making himself miserable and refusing to do something he clearly wanted to do (and which he ultimately did after Elsa sat down and talked to him for a while), all because he was taught that fucking coloring is too girly. That's what I think of when people talk of gender-neutral parenting, not pronouns. This scenario seems out of norm to me. My 3-year-old son loves to draw and color. As do all other boys in that age range to my knowledge (friends/familial year kids, other kid in daycare, etc...). I’ve never heard of drawing or coloring being considered “girly” in my life.
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Post by MsMovieStar on Apr 28, 2019 23:21:20 GMT
Oh honeys, I think gender neutering sounds barbaric! I'm sure it would be bad for business...
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dazed
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Post by dazed on Apr 28, 2019 23:22:24 GMT
Definitely not.
I wouldn’t start the process of putting them on hormones either when they’re young.
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Post by bob-coppola on Apr 29, 2019 1:00:13 GMT
But... putting hormones on children isn't gender-neutral parenting? Gender-neutral parenting is not even related to "transgender kids" (that's a whole other conversation). By my understanding, it is about raising your children and teaching them that they can be whatever they want to be regardless of their gender.
So yeah, I really want to have children (if my financial condition allows me, I'd love to have three or more) and I want them to grow up not feeling inferior just for the sake of being a girl, or with them knowing they don't have to internalize any kind of angst because they're boys. It's so common to have baby girls have their ears pierced when they're infants! Or how little boys are taught they can't cry because that's "gay"/"a girl's thing". It seems like a small thing, but it's a sign of a much bigger phenomenon. Society already has way too many misinformed and harmful idead floating around, I want to do my best to help my kids to be happy.
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Zeb31
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Post by Zeb31 on Apr 29, 2019 4:05:12 GMT
Piercing infants' ears is very much a thing. That's fucked. But 14K gold looks so pretty on newborn skin. In all seriousness, it's pretty senseless, yeah.
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Zeb31
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Post by Zeb31 on Apr 29, 2019 4:10:04 GMT
Eh, I think that still varies depending on where you are. In my family the notion of a baby girl (I'm talking like <6 months here) going out in public without some clear signifier of girlhood like earrings or a hair bow is an immediate no-no, because having your baby mistaken for the opposite sex is a legitimately scary possibility. So yeah, that binary notion is very much alive and well in some places, which means that the whole umbrella of gender-neutral parenting is (as I understand it) mostly comprised of things that should just be basic common sense. Here's another anecdote no one asked for: I was at a kid's birthday party a few months ago. It was Frozen-themed and they even had entertainers dressed up as Elsa and Anna. Really early on in the party, the only children that had arrived were like 4 girls and 1 boy. The girls were all playing among themselves and having fun, while the boy was sat in a corner by himself looking sad. Elsa went up to him and asked what was wrong, and he said he couldn't join the girls because they were drawing and coloring, and both those things (as well as Frozen) are for girls, so he had to wait for another boy to arrive so they could do something else together. And it made me so angry that this 4-year-old was consciously making himself miserable and refusing to do something he clearly wanted to do (and which he ultimately did after Elsa sat down and talked to him for a while), all because he was taught that fucking coloring is too girly. That's what I think of when people talk of gender-neutral parenting, not pronouns. This scenario seems out of norm to me. My 3-year-old son loves to draw and color. As do all other boys in that age range to my knowledge (friends/familial year kids, other kid in daycare, etc...). I’ve never heard of drawing or coloring being considered “girly” in my life. Again, that's vastly dependent on context and culture. That anyone would take issue with coloring of all things was kinda jarring to me at first, but it's not a complete shock. Some more conservative environments/households are absolutely drenched in that kind of paranoia.
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Post by IceTruckDexter on Apr 29, 2019 22:42:54 GMT
I mean, the whole "X is for boys!" and "Y is for girls!" is practically dead by now. I see boys wear pink, girls play rougher sports, boys who love to cook, and it goes on and on and on. It still exists somewhat, but it's not nearly as prevalent as it once was. The whole child pronoun bullshit is ridiculous, though. It's a fucking baby, it doesn't even know if it's hungry or needs to take a shit-- let alone what pronoun it would like to be called. Is it? You have no idea how hard I've tried to get my nieces into football. They just don't like it, while I didn't even try with my nephew and he loves it.
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Post by IceTruckDexter on Apr 29, 2019 22:44:43 GMT
Piercing infants' ears is very much a thing. That's fucked. There's an entire group of people that cut the foreskin off of baby boys and nobody bats an eyelash. At least people are revolted by female genital mutilation.
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